View source for Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Destruction of Israel in Iranian policy

<noinclude>{{pp-extended|small=yes}}</noinclude>
{{Not a ballot}}

<div class="boilerplate afd vfd xfd-closed archived mw-archivedtalk" style="background-color: var(--background-color-progressive-subtle, #F3F9FF); color: var(--color-base, inherit); margin: 2em 0 0 0; padding: 0 10px 0 10px; border: 1px solid var(--border-color-subtle, #AAAAAA);">
:''The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. <span style="color:var(--color-error, red);">'''Please do not modify it.'''</span>  Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's [[Help:Using talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]).  No further edits should be made to this page.''
<!--Template:Afd top

Note:  If you are seeing this page as a result of an attempt to re-nominate an article for deletion, you must manually edit the AfD nomination links to create a new discussion page using the name format of [[Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/PAGENAME (2nd nomination)]].  When you create the new discussion page, please provide a link to this old discussion in your nomination. -->

The result was '''merge'''‎__EXPECTED_UNCONNECTED_PAGE__ to [[Iran-Israel relations]]. Many of the keep/oppose !votes assert that the topic is notable; as others have pointed out, that is not the issue at hand here. The issue is whether it is a POV fork, and where to discuss the topic if it is. Given the pov, [[WP:COATRACK]], and other concerns, it appears most appropriate to merge into the parent article and discuss the content there ''first'', creating a [[WP:SPINOUT]] if necessary due to length. There is strong support for a merge to [[Iran-Israel relations]] in particular, so that is where I am closing this. Editors are welcome to discuss on that talk page whether some of this material should be merged to other articles, as suggested in this AfD. [[User:Asilvering|asilvering]] ([[User talk:Asilvering|talk]]) 05:23, 22 June 2025 (UTC)
===[[:Destruction of Israel in Iranian policy]]===
<noinclude>{{AFD help}}</noinclude>
:{{la|1=Destruction of Israel in Iranian policy}} – (<includeonly>[[Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Destruction of Israel in Iranian policy|View AfD]]</includeonly><noinclude>[[Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Log/2025 June 13#{{anchorencode:Destruction of Israel in Iranian policy}}|View log]]</noinclude> | [[Special:Diff/1295356550/cur|edits since nomination]])
:({{Find sources AFD|title=Destruction of Israel in Iranian policy}})

This article looks like a recreation of the old article "[https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Calls_for_the_destruction_of_Israel&oldid=1270885022 Calls for the destruction of Israel]", which was merged in January 2025 ([[Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Calls for the destruction of Israel (2nd nomination)]]). This article might as well be called "Iranian calls for the destruction of Israel" and thus it has the same problems as the previous one – it is a [[WP:POVFORK]] of [[Legitimacy of the State of Israel]]. Propose '''merge''' just like the previous article. '''[[User talk:Vice regent|VR]]''' <sub>(Please [[Template:Ping|ping]] on reply)</sub> 08:35, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
*<small class="delsort-notice">Note:  This discussion has been included in the [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Deletion sorting|deletion sorting]] lists for the following topics: [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Deletion sorting/Bilateral relations|Bilateral relations]], [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Deletion sorting/Military|Military]], [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Deletion sorting/Iran|Iran]],  and [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Deletion sorting/Israel|Israel]]. [[User:Shellwood|Shellwood]] ([[User talk:Shellwood|talk]]) 08:44, 13 June 2025 (UTC)</small>

*Pings to all users who took part in the previous discussion: {{u|Simonm223}},{{u|AndreJustAndre}},{{u|XDanielx}},{{u|Iskandar323}},{{u|Selfstudier}},{{u|إيان}},{{u|Mason7512}},{{u|Shellwood}},{{u|Aquillion}},{{u|שלומית ליר}},{{u|Zero0000}},{{u|Sean.hoyland}},{{u|MaskedSinger}},{{u|Lewisguile}},{{u|Sinclairian}},{{u|Boksi}},{{u|Smallangryplanet}},{{u|Eliezer1987}},{{u|Shoogiboogi}},{{u|Liz}},{{u|Firecat}},{{u|My very best wishes}},{{u|Genabab}},{{u|Cdjp1}},{{u|Vanamonde93}},{{u|The Grid}},{{u|Lf8u2}},{{u|BePrepared1907}},{{u|Allthemilescombined1}},{{u|Wikieditor662}},{{u|Codonified}},{{u|Originalcola}},{{u|berchanhimez}}. <small>I used a script to generate these, so apologies if I missed someone, or added someone who I shouldn't have</small>.'''[[User talk:Vice regent|VR]]''' <sub>(Please [[Template:Ping|ping]] on reply)</sub> 08:49, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
* '''Oppose''' (creator). I respectfully disagree with the claim that this article is a "recreation" of anything. This article is focused on a different topic: it examines Iran's official policy and strategic posture toward the destruction of Israel, as characterized by a range of reliable secondary sources. It does not merely document rhetorical calls or statements made by various actors, but rather explores a long-term, very grounded policy, which includes several aspects: military doctrine, foreign relations, proxy activity, and nuclear strategy, all directed at eliminating Israel as a Jewish state. The content, sources, and framing are substantially different from the previous article, both in scope and intent. Therefore, it cannot be accurately described neither as a recreation nor as a POV fork. [[User:Rafi Chazon|Rafi Chazon]] ([[User talk:Rafi Chazon|talk]]) 08:50, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
::If it is about Iran's relations with Israel, why can it not be at [[Iran-Israel relations]]? Why the POV framing of what is a complex issue and involves antagonism on both sides? '''[[User talk:Vice regent|VR]]''' <sub>(Please [[Template:Ping|ping]] on reply)</sub> 09:06, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
::While I'm not disputing your whole argument, I just want to say that an article being very well researched and sourced isn't an inherent reason to keep and article if there's issues with it being an article in the first place. [[User:AssanEcho|AssanEcho]] ([[User talk:AssanEcho|talk]]) 11:28, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
:::It’s not just that the article is well-researched and properly sourced. The focus here isn’t on rhetorical "calls", it's on a sustained strategy, policy, or project, however one chooses to label it. Iran's actions: funding and training militant groups to encircle Israel, promoting suicide bombings, advancing a nuclear program aimed at threatening Israel, and broadcasting countdowns to Israel's destruction, are not isolated statements. they are deliberate steps within a long-term vision. And this isn't my interpretation of course, it reflects the view of leading scholars. As Afshon Ostovar wrote in a 2024 Oxford University Press publication, "The goal of destroying Israel as a Jewish entity is a cornerstone of the Islamic Republic of Iran's regional strategy." This is clearly a notable topic, with enough coverage and depth to merit its own article. [[User:Rafi Chazon|Rafi Chazon]] ([[User talk:Rafi Chazon|talk]]) 11:37, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
::::Again, I was not commenting to dispute your argument though I have my own issues with it (You can read them on my multi merge reply), and to comment I do actually believe you and your sources that this a concrete goal of the Iranian Government. I was just mentioning that any article's high quality is not necessarily a reason to keep it in any AFD. [[User:AssanEcho|AssanEcho]] ([[User talk:AssanEcho|talk]]) 11:50, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
:::::This really does feel, based on the above, like a POV fork of [[Iran-Israel relations]] - @[[User:Rafi_Chazon|Rafi Chazon]] it's clear you put a lot of work into this and nobody is suggesting it's non-notable. It's just that the page that is specifically about the relationship between these two states is a better home for this material than a breakaway page with an eye-catching header. [[User:Simonm223|Simonm223]] ([[User talk:Simonm223|talk]]) 11:54, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
:'''Support Merge''' This is an overly specific page. It should be merged into either Legitimacy of the State of Israel or [[Foreign relations of Iran]] where it would be more at home. [[User:Genabab|Genabab]] ([[User talk:Genabab|talk]]) 08:53, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Oppose''' I don’t see any reason to delete; the article seems both notable and detailed enough to stand on its own, with an appropriate link and summary in the general article. [[User:Jellyfish dave|Jellyfish dave]] ([[User talk:Jellyfish dave|talk]]) 08:56, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
*:Agreed. In this time, such an article is quite important to understanding the conflict between Israel and Iran. [[User:SleepTrain456|<span style="color:152234">SleepTrain456</span>]] 03:14, 17 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Merge''' to [[Legitimacy of the State of Israel]]. POVFORK. [[User:Gotitbro|Gotitbro]] ([[User talk:Gotitbro|talk]]) 09:08, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Oppose''': Personally, I think Vice Regent’s deletion of the article was completely out of line. As for the merits of the article itself, the scope is clear and well-defined. There’s a substantial body of reliable news reporting and academic literature that directly addresses this issue. It’s certainly notable — it’s a topic that has drawn the attention of numerous scholars and analysts, and it's clearly of interest within the broader body of literature.
*:This article has encyclopaedic value, as it demonstrates that a single paragraph on the ''Iran–Israel relations'' page wouldn’t come close to adequately covering the subject. The article should be retained. I’d encourage editors to prioritise collaborative solutions rather than tearing down articles that can be improved. [[User:KiltedKangaroo|KiltedKangaroo]] ([[User talk:KiltedKangaroo|talk]]) 09:10, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
*:I don't think this AfD/merger proposal is "completely out of line". We could(and probably should) devote much more space on the Iran-Israel relations page than a singular paragraph to cover this subject. [[User:Originalcola|Originalcola]] ([[User talk:Originalcola|talk]]) 17:45, 13 June 2025 (UTC)

: {| class="wikitable sortable"
! Citation !! Publisher/Source !! Type
|-
| Ostovar, Afshon (2024). ''Wars of Ambition'' || Oxford University Press || Academic
|-
| Maloney, Suzanne (2024). "The Middle East's Dangerous New Normal" || ''Foreign Affairs'' || Notable / Expert Commentary
|-
| Karsh, Efraim (2023). "The Israel-Iran conflict" || ''Israel Affairs'' (peer-reviewed journal) || Academic
|-
| Reda, Latife (2016). "Origins of the Islamic Republic's Strategic Approaches" || ''Middle East Critique'' || Academic
|-
| Freilich, Charles David (2018). ''Israeli National Security'' || Oxford University Press || Academic
|-
| Erdbrink, Thomas (2015) || ''The New York Times'' || Reliable Media
|-
| "Iran: Khamenei to lead Friday prayers..." (2020) || ''The Guardian'' || Reliable Media
|-
| Pileggi, Tamar (2018) || ''Times of Israel'' || Reliable Media
|-
| "Iran's Khamenei says..." (2021) || ''France 24'' || Reliable Media
|-
| "Iran leader says Israel a 'cancerous tumour'" (2020) || ''The Economic Times'' || Semi Reliable Media
|-
| "Iran's Khamenei tells visiting Hamas chief..." (2024) || ''Times of Israel'' || Reliable Media
|-
| "Iran president sees 'countdown' to Israel's end" (2007) || ''Reuters'' || Reliable Media
|-
| "Iran's Rouhani calls Israel a 'cancerous tumor'" || ''Al Jazeera'' || Reliable Media
|-
| "Iranian President Repeats Calls..." (2023) || ''Iran International'' || Reliable Media
|-
| Goldberg, Jeffrey (2015) || ''The Atlantic'' || Notable / Expert Commentary
|-
| Hafezi, Parisa (2023) || ''Reuters'' || Reliable Media
|-
| Said et al. (2023-2024) || ''Wall Street Journal'' || Reliable Media
|-
| "Hamas received weapons and training from Iran..." (2023) || ''The Washington Post'' || Reliable Media
|-
| Fassihi, Farnaz (2024) || ''The New York Times'' || Reliable Media
|-
| Allin, Dana H.; Simon, Steven (2010). ''The Sixth Crisis'' || Oxford University Press || Academic
|-
| Sharma, Anu (2022). ''Through the Looking Glass'' || Routledge, Taylor & Francis Group || Academic
|-
| Magen, Ze'ev (2023). ''Reading Revolutionary Iran'' || De Gruyter || Academic
|-
| Reda, Latife (2016). (duplicate entry) || ''Middle East Critique'' || Academic
|-
| "Iranian protesters unveil clock..." (2017) || ''The Independent'' || Reliable Media
|-
| Azizi, Arash (2025) || ''The Atlantic'' || Notable / Expert Commentary
|-
| "Iranians Criticize Quds Day's Futility..." (2024) || ''Iran International'' || Reliable Media
|-
| Shamir, Shlomo || ''Chabad.org'' ||  Niche Media
|}
: Here’s a list of sources. Hopefully, these references make a strong case for the article’s importance. Cheers! [[User:KiltedKangaroo|KiltedKangaroo]] ([[User talk:KiltedKangaroo|talk]]) 09:13, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
::To clarify: no one is disputing this topic's [[WP:NOTABILITY]], but rather it is a [[WP:POVFORK]] of an existing article.'''[[User talk:Vice regent|VR]]''' <sub>(Please [[Template:Ping|ping]] on reply)</sub> 09:33, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
:::And if you look at the list of sources most of them seem to be about Iran Israel relations so I'd actually argue that they support the merge proposal. ([[User talk:Buidhe|t]] &#183; [[Special:Contributions/Buidhe|c]]) '''[[User:buidhe|<span style="color: black">buidhe</span>]]''' 11:51, 14 June 2025 (UTC)
{{cait}}
::Considering the various arguments presented, I decided to thoroughly examine WP:GNG.
::Significant coverage: The article synthesises extensive academic, journalistic, and policy-oriented literature on Iranian rhetoric, ideology, and policy towards Israel. It is not a passing mention in the media but a well-documented, recurring subject in both regional and international affairs.
::- Reliable secondary sources: Sources cited in the article include:
::- Academic works
::- Scholarly journal articles,
::- Books published by university presses and independent research institutions,
::- Major international news outlets
::- Think tanks 
::Independence of sources: The cited sources are clearly independent of the subject and are not self-published or partisan in a promotional way. For example, the article references scholars who critically analyse Iranian rhetoric, as well as media coverage of official Iranian statements.
::2. Topical Notability: Enduring Interest and Impact
::The topic has enduring geopolitical and historical significance. The ideological hostility between the Islamic Republic of Iran and Israel is a longstanding, well-documented theme that influences regional diplomacy, conflict dynamics (e.g., in Syria, Lebanon, and Gaza), and global security discussions. It is not a transient or marginal issue. This topic appears regularly in international relations scholarship, Middle Eastern studies, and foreign policy analyses. Statements by Iranian leaders about Israel whether in the form of policy pronouncements or ideological slogans are analysed by governments, international organisations, and media outlets across the political spectrum.
::3. Separability from Other Articles
::While the topic of this article naturally has some overlap with broader subjects (such as Iran–Israel relations or Iranian foreign policy), it isdistinct and coherent since it presents:
::- The ideological and rhetorical framing of Israel’s destruction as a political goal,
::- Its evolution across different time(from Khomeini to Khamenei),
::- The difference between symbolic rhetoric and realpolitik,
::- Its impact on proxy strategy and nuclear discourse.
::This justifies a stand-alone article under Wikipedia’s Summary Style guideline, which encourages subtopics to be split into separate entries when justified by their length or depth.
::Regarding the argument that this article could be merged into a broader one:
::While related, the article focuses on a specific, coherent theme: Iran’s ideological framing distinct from broader diplomatic or military relations. This deserves discrete treatment under Wikipedia’s Summary Style guidelines, as the topic spans multiple governments and impacts nuclear discourse, proxy strategy, and Middle Eastern security.
::4. Neutral Point of View and Encyclopaedic Tone
::- It presents multiple interpretations (e.g., rhetorical vs actual policy),
::- It does not endorse or dismiss the idea, but rather documents how it has been articulated and understood.
::5. Public and Scholarly Relevance
::Given rising tensions in the Middle East, ongoing discourse surrounding Iran’s nuclear programme, and international debates over the interpretation of Iranian leaders’ statements about Israel, this topic is extremely relevant and is frequently referenced in policymaking (just listen to Western arguments), academic scholarship, and public debate.
::Some editors may view the article as being too niche or trivial - Far from trivial, this rhetoric is a core pillar of Iran’s strategic positioning shaping its regional conflicts (e.g., Hezbollah, Gaza), nuclear policy, and global alliances. It has been a recurring theme over decades, not a passing trend. Academics and foreign policy analysts routinely reference and analyse it.
::Regarding editors who may view the topic as outdated or less relevant:
::Far from it. The rhetoric continues to have real-world implications. The destruction of Israel in Iranian policy is said to have prompted Israeli airstrikes in June 2025.
{{caib}}
::[[User:KiltedKangaroo|KiltedKangaroo]] ([[User talk:KiltedKangaroo|talk]]) 13:10, 16 June 2025 (UTC)
::: {{u|KiltedKangaroo}}, the use of [[WP:LLM|LLM-generated]] arguments in Wikipedia discussions, especially without [[WP:LLMDISCLOSE|proper disclosure]], is not acceptable. Please describe your points in your own words. —&nbsp;'''''[[User:Newslinger|<span style="color:#536267;">Newslinger</span>]]'''&nbsp;<small>[[User talk:Newslinger#top|<span style="color:#708090;">talk</span>]]</small>'' 14:15, 18 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Oppose''' This article is much more focused on Iranian policy and thus is neither a simple fork of the other article nor a recreation in any sense. It embodies a different scope. [[User:Nehushtani|Nehushtani]] ([[User talk:Nehushtani|talk]]) 09:18, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
*<s>'''Strong Oppose''' We only need to follow the news to see how relevant this article is and as for the article itself, it stands on its own 2 feet. [[User:MaskedSinger|MaskedSinger]] ([[User talk:MaskedSinger|talk]]) 09:20, 13 June 2025 (UTC)</s> <small>Sock strike</small>
::<s>'''And Comment''' But as an aside {{u|Vice regent}} if we're here to collaborate on an encyclopedia, consistency should be applied across Wikipedia and it shouldn't matter whether the article is pro-Israel or anti-Israel. But when things come down to a consensus or what not, this clearly isn't the case. There is a plethora of anti-Israel articles and I don't see people calling for merging them, deleting them or [[WP:POVFORK]].I'm not accusing you of this - I'm saying this is a big picture zoomed out issue that needs to be address for the betterment of Wikipedia.[[User:MaskedSinger|MaskedSinger]] ([[User talk:MaskedSinger|talk]]) 09:19, 13 June 2025 (UTC)</s> <small>Sock strike</small>
*'''Merge''' to [[Iran–Israel relations]]. We don't need more POV forks and one just has to read the lead to see that POV fork is a perfect description. This article is an NPOV violation by design. [[User:Zero0000|Zero]]<sup><small>[[User_talk:Zero0000|talk]]</small></sup> 09:50, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Merge''' to [[Iran-Israel relations]], of which it's a [[WP:POVFORK]]; possibly also move some stuff to [[Legitimacy of the State of Israel]]. The argument that we should "look at recent events" to show why this narrow subset of that article supposedly needs to be its own article also shows that this article's creation is a matter of [[WP:RECENTISM]], but even then, [[Iran-Israel relations]] is a more neutral article to cover this sort of thing and no valid reasons have been presented for why we would spin off a more POV copy of it. All the presented sources would be more accurately and thoroughly examined at that article - most of them are not specifically about Iran calling for the ''destruction of Israel'' but are about Iran / Israeli relations more generally, which means pulling out just that part and trying to make an article about it without covering the rest is misusing them as sources. --[[User:Aquillion|Aquillion]] ([[User talk:Aquillion|talk]]) 10:00, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
* '''Oppose'''. I agree with the previous editors here, mainly because this topic is way too broad and complex to squeeze into just a subsection of Iran–Israel relations or Legitimacy of the State of Israel. We're not just talking about rhetoric or ideology here – this covers military strategy, foreign policy, proxy wars, educational systems, and a whole lot more. Iran's approach to eliminating Israel is so systematic and institutional that it really deserves its own standalone article, especially given all the academic research and journalism we have on it. If we merge this somewhere else, readers won't get the full picture of how extensive and significant this issue actually is. [[User:Eliezer1987|Eliezer1987]] ([[User talk:Eliezer1987|talk]]) 10:24, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
* '''Oppose''' I don't see why today, of all days, that article should be deleted. If anything, it should be expanded in order to provide even more background information.--[[User:Edelseider|Edelseider]] ([[User talk:Edelseider|talk]]) 10:34, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
*:I'm not sure why Israel attacking Iran equates to needing an independent article about Iran calling for an end to Israel when we already have [[Iran-Israel relations]]. This appears not to be a policy based reason to retain an article. [[User:Simonm223|Simonm223]] ([[User talk:Simonm223|talk]]) 11:25, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
* '''Oppose'''  This article presents a well-sourced, analytically distinct examination of Iranian state policy toward the destruction of Israel. Far from being a content fork, it addresses a clearly delineated and academically acknowledged phenomenon that spans military doctrine, proxy engagement, nuclear strategy, and ideological incitement. To reduce this topic to a subsection elsewhere would obscure its scope and scholarly relevance. At a time when Wikipedia must uphold its responsibility to present verifiable knowledge with intellectual integrity, removing such a page risks erasing a central dimension of contemporary Middle Eastern geopolitics and signals a troubling asymmetry in editorial standards. [[User:שלומית ליר|שלומית ליר]] ([[User talk:שלומית ליר|talk]]) 10:46, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
* '''Multi Merge''' Honestly I don't see much in this article that necessitates it be it's own article and not be merged in with [[Calls for the destruction of Israel]], [[Iran-Israel relations]], or even [[New antisemitism]] (as much as I personally don't care for the articles concept myself). This article's existence is smelling of [[WP:RECENT|recency bias]] due to the current catastrophe in the middle east, and while this doesn't have much to do with this topic it does seem to be mildly biased against Iran by not mentioning any international or internal support for the various actions, policies and intions (though I do believe 100% that every example of dissent and distain is real).
:[[User:AssanEcho|AssanEcho]] ([[User talk:AssanEcho|talk]]) 11:08, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
* '''Multi Merge''' This does seem like a PoV fork of a few different articles. For the most part either [[Legitimacy of Israel]] or [[Iran-Israel relations]] seem appropriate destinations for this material. [[User:Simonm223|Simonm223]] ([[User talk:Simonm223|talk]]) 11:23, 13 June 2025 (UTC)

:'''Oppose'''  This article offers a well-documented and clearly focused analysis of Iran’s official policy aimed at the destruction of Israel.  Merging this topic into a broader article would dilute its significance and obscure a distinct, long-standing pillar of Iranian state policy. The sustained calls for Israel’s destruction by Iran’s leadership, their integration into official doctrine, and their geopolitical consequences warrant focused, in-depth treatment that a subsection cannot adequately provide. This is not a minor aspect of Iranian politics—it is a central theme with global ramifications, deserving its own dedicated space for clarity, documentation, and analysis. Deletion would set a dangerous precedent of removing uncomfortable historical realities from Wikipedia simply because they are unpopular. [[User:Cfgauss77|Cfgauss77]] ([[User talk:Cfgauss77|talk]]) 11:41, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
::No "uncomfortable historical realities" would be removed due to (un)popularity, or at least from what I can see I don't think anyone is suggesting that. [[User:Originalcola|Originalcola]] ([[User talk:Originalcola|talk]]) 17:01, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
:::I agree. Nobody is suggesting that. [[User:Simonm223|Simonm223]] ([[User talk:Simonm223|talk]]) 17:13, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
* '''Oppose''' As per [[User:Rafi Chazon|Rafi Chazon]], [[User:שלומית ליר|
שלומית ליר]] and [[User:KiltedKangaroo|KiltedKangaroo]] [[User:Plantbaseddiet|Plantbaseddiet]] ([[User talk:Plantbaseddiet|talk]]) 12:34, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Merge''' - Clear-cut POVFORK of a few articles. [[User:Orientls|Orientls]] ([[User talk:Orientls|talk]]) 14:58, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Oppose''' - Having a separate article allows for an appropriate amount of detail that couldn't be sufficiently covered by the proposed merge target without derailing the focus of the latter. <span style="color:#4CBB17">--Posted by</span> [[User:Pikamander2|<span style="color:#007FFF">Pikamander2</span>]] <small>[[User Talk:Pikamander2|<span style="color:#007FFF">(Talk)</span>]]</small> at 15:16, 13 June 2025 (UTC)

*'''Merge''' sounds good to me, here – obvious POVFORK. I'll also note an [https://x.com/WikiBias2024/status/1933466077989568653 active canvassing attempt] ([https://archive.ph/2xEEQ archive]) regarding this AfD, including an [https://x.com/WikiBias2024/status/1933466093172965490 explicit call for the process to be stopped, including a link to this very page] ([https://archive.ph/E774v archive]). [[User:Smallangryplanet|Smallangryplanet]] ([[User talk:Smallangryplanet|talk]]) 15:16, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
*:To frame as "censorship", a valid AfD which follows from consensus at [[Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Calls for the destruction of Israel (2nd nomination)]] is something. Just to clarify: nothing is being deleted here, the content exists at other places, whether we need a separate article on a subtopic of an article which we already decided to merge is a very valid proposition. This canvassing then to target the AfD is unacceptable. [[User:Gotitbro|Gotitbro]] ([[User talk:Gotitbro|talk]]) 17:37, 13 June 2025 (UTC)

* '''Oppose nom & keep article''' The article's scope and content look pretty different from the previous.  Also: this here separate article lets us have a deeper level of details/sources that can't be properly contented at the proposed merge target.  Retain this well sourced article, which cannot be considered a fork, as its subject matter is highly specific. [[User:XavierItzm|XavierItzm]] ([[User talk:XavierItzm|talk]]) 15:30, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
* '''Merge''' to [[Iran-Israel relations]] and [[Legitimacy of Israel]] to avoid [[WP:POVFORK]]. The canvassing mentioned upthread is quite worrying. [[User:Lewisguile|Lewisguile]] ([[User talk:Lewisguile|talk]]) 15:42, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
*:'''Comment:''' Having gone through and edited this article significantly just now, I think it is essentially the same article as before the merge. It also has major problems. Some whole sections are/were sourced to a single writer, and this makes the POVfork issues worse. It's also an odd focus, when we do t usually focus on inter-state grievances in this sort of detail. Should we, for instance, have an article '''Israeli rhetoric on Iran'''? Or '''Al-Qaeda's policy on the destruction of America'''? Because that's currently what this feels like—a one-sided take on something that, while it's obviously true, is better placed within context elsewhere rather than feeling like it's written with an agenda. [[User:Lewisguile|Lewisguile]] ([[User talk:Lewisguile|talk]]) 17:36, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
*::To be fair, as of the posting of this reply I don't believe anyone replying with arguments opposed to merging or deletion are canvassers or writing with bad faith, even if I think some arguments are more emotional than rational personally. [[User:AssanEcho|AssanEcho]] ([[User talk:AssanEcho|talk]]) 19:06, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Comment''' It is common, in cases where an AfD centers around a PoV fork to get a lot of editors saying they want to keep because the topic is notable. We know the topic is notable. Because there is a whole other article on it. Nobody wants to delete [[Iran-Israel relations]]. But, frankly, when Israel starts bombing a regional enemy and suddenly a POV fork appears that wants to assert that really it's the enemy's fault there's a pretty serious [[WP:NPOV]] concern that makes such a POV fork rather problematic. Reliable information should be retained on the appropriate destination page but this appears to be a POV push. [[User:Simonm223|Simonm223]] ([[User talk:Simonm223|talk]]) 16:27, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
*:Good point re: "notability". [[User:Lewisguile|Lewisguile]] ([[User talk:Lewisguile|talk]]) 17:30, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
*:The off-wiki canvassing and abuse of process is also concerning. Not surprised its happening at anti-wikipedia accounts on Musk's X (who's views about our project we know pretty well). [[User:Gotitbro|Gotitbro]] ([[User talk:Gotitbro|talk]]) 17:52, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
*::That will hopefully have minimal impact as the closer will discard any !votes from non-extended confirmed editors. [[User:Simonm223|Simonm223]] ([[User talk:Simonm223|talk]]) 19:32, 13 June 2025 (UTC)

:'''Oppose''' per [[User:Rafi Chazon|Rafi Chazon]], [[User:Edelseider|Edelseider]], [[User:Jellyfish dave|Jellyfish dave]], etc. [[User:SleepTrain456|<span style="color:152234">SleepTrain456</span>]] 03:14, 17 June 2025 (UTC)

<s>:'''Merge with [[Iran–Israel relations]]''' - As in the previous discussion the issue here isn't notability, that really isn't in dispute. I don't think this article is a recreation of the previous article has severe NPOV issues as in the previous deletion, but I think it would be better served merged into this existing article especially since this topic is so intertwined with Iranian-Israeli relations. I don't know if this is a POVFORK but I don't think the article should stand either way. [[User:Originalcola|Originalcola]] ([[User talk:Originalcola|talk]]) 16:55, 13 June 2025 (UTC)</s> Changed vote
::'''Oppose''' - After looking at the [[Legitimacy of the State of Israel]] and [[Iranian-Israeli relations]] articles I couldn't see any disputes to suggest this page was created as a POV fork. The argument that this is a POV fork because of the focus on one side's viewpoint doesn't seem to hold here, the current article does seem to be written fairly neutral. I also think that my initial concerns about it being too intertwined with Iranian-Israeli relations were unfounded and that the topic can be covered outside a main article. A merge may add undue weight towards this topic on any page it's merged into, so keeping it separate may be a better choice here. The current title is ok as is, and I don't think that the article is the same as the previously deleted article despite being superficially similar in topic. [[User:Originalcola|Originalcola]] ([[User talk:Originalcola|talk]]) 14:29, 15 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Merge''' to [[Iran-Israel relations]]. We do not need multiple articles on the same topic. [[User:Hauskasic|Hauskasic]] ([[User talk:Hauskasic|talk]]) 19:28, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
* '''Oppose''' (as per the creator). As per Rafi. With regards, [[User:Oleg Yunakov|<span style="font-family:Segoe Script;">Oleg Y.</span>]] ([[User talk:Oleg Yunakov|talk]]) 22:31, 13 June 2025 (UTC)
* '''Keep''', no merge. This is different from the more general page [[Calls for the destruction of Israel]]. The calls by the top Iranian officials for destruction of Israel lies at the heart of the [[Iran and weapons of mass destruction]] controversy. This is important as the alleged ''[[casus belli]]'' of the currently ongoing war. Israel calls their recent attack a [[preemptive strike]] because the destruction of Israel was the openly and officially stated goal of Iran. [[User:My very best wishes|My very best wishes]] ([[User talk:My very best wishes|talk]]) 01:05, 14 June 2025 (UTC)

*'''Oppose''' article deletion as proposed by OP. Article seems a decently well-written (with scholarly/academic treatment of the subject) on a major subpart of Iranian national policy for multiple decades.  Seems well explicated for an encyclopedic treatment, well sourced, and is sufficiently large to be inadequately covered inside another, more general, article on calls for the destruction of Israel.  This argues for keeping it, as a contribution to the expansive encyclopedia of human knowledge, Wikipedia.  [[User:N2e|N2e]] ([[User talk:N2e|talk]]) 01:18, 14 June 2025 (UTC)

*'''Keep''', this article is a well-written, thorough exploration of a significant documented phenomenon, and this nomination smacks of [[WP:IDONTLIKEIT]]. [[User:Qualiesin|Qualiesin]] ([[User talk:Qualiesin|talk]]) 02:25, 14 June 2025 (UTC)

*'''Oppose''', largely for the reasons given by [[User:שלומית ליר|
שלומית ליר]] above.--<span style='color: darkblue;text-shadow:gray 0.3em 0.3em 0.1em; class=texhtml'>Surv1v4l1st</span> <sup><span style="font-size:7px">╠[[User_talk:Surv1v4l1st|Talk]]║[[Special:Contributions/Surv1v4l1st|Contribs]]╣</span></sup> 04:40, 14 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' - Blatant POV fork crafted from a variety of articles to push a Zionist POV  in the backdrop of Israel's attack on Iran. [[User:Koshuri Sultan|<span style="color:#FFB6C1;background:#000;font-family:Georgia;font-weight:bold;">Koshuri</span>]] [[User Talk:Koshuri Sultan|<span style="color:#000;font-weight:bold;"><sup>(グ)</sup></span>]] 04:44, 14 June 2025 (UTC)
*:This is an extraordinarily [[WP:AGF|assumption of bad faith]] argument and is not a legitimate reason to delete. — '''[[User:Czello|<i style="color:#8000FF">Czello</i>]]''' <sup>''([[User talk:Czello|<i style="color:#8000FF">music</i>]])''</sup> 10:32, 14 June 2025 (UTC)
* '''Merge with [[Legitimacy of the State of Israel]]''': Per the consensus established at [[Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Calls for the destruction of Israel (2nd nomination)]] and because the article is a [[WP:POVFORK]] of ''Legitimacy of the State of Israel''. ''[[User:TarnishedPath|<b style="color:#ff0000;">Tar</b><b style="color:#ff7070;">nis</b><b style="color:#ffa0a0;">hed</b><b style="color:#420000;">Path</b>]]''<sup>[[User talk:TarnishedPath|<b style="color:#bd4004;">talk</b>]]</sup> 09:38, 14 June 2025 (UTC) <!--VCB TarnishedPath-->
*'''Keep''' (ie '''oppose''' delete or merge) as this is a valid narrower topic not directly related to "legitimacy". Also the article is already big enough to split off  a potential merger target. The broader article would be [[Iran–Israel relations]], but this is already quite large. [[User:Graeme Bartlett|Graeme Bartlett]] ([[User talk:Graeme Bartlett|talk]]) 10:09, 14 June 2025 (UTC)
* '''Keep''', no merge: I don't see this as a content fork, and instead has a well sourced presentation of Iranian policy which goes beyond the Iran–Israel relations article.   — '''[[User:Czello|<i style="color:#8000FF">Czello</i>]]''' <sup>''([[User talk:Czello|<i style="color:#8000FF">music</i>]])''</sup> 10:31, 14 June 2025 (UTC) <!--VCB Czello-->
*:Can you explain what the scope of this article has that would not already be in scope of [[Iran-Israel relations]]? '''[[User talk:Vice regent|VR]]''' <sub>(Please [[Template:Ping|ping]] on reply)</sub> 23:39, 14 June 2025 (UTC)
*::The relations article currently sits at over 9k words. Per [[WP:AS]], this is at such a size that it should be split. Presenting a deeper dive into Iranian policy, which goes further than just the history of their relations and their current situation, can justifiably be presented as a separate article. — '''[[User:Czello|<i style="color:#8000FF">Czello</i>]]''' <sup>''([[User talk:Czello|<i style="color:#8000FF">music</i>]])''</sup> 10:31, 15 June 2025 (UTC)
*:::I have been thinking about the issues raised surrounding NPOV and accuracy, and was wondering if a move to "Iranian foreign policy regarding Israel [after 1979?]" or similar may allow a shift to a slightly broader framing that remains a subset of the broader Iran–Israel relations. [[User:Chipmunkdavis|CMD]] ([[User talk:Chipmunkdavis|talk]]) 10:43, 15 June 2025 (UTC)
*::::@[[User:Chipmunkdavis|Chipmunkdavis]] I would agree that would be a valid article scope. However, I would prefer [[Iranian-Israeli relations (post-1979)]], because that could include both Iranian policies towards Israel and Israeli policies towards Iran. With your approach it would necessitate a parallel article [[Israeli policy regarding Iran (post-1979)]] and because policies are often reciprocal, a lot of content would be duplicated. Nevertheless, I think you suggestion is a good compromise.'''[[User talk:Vice regent|VR]]''' <sub>(Please [[Template:Ping|ping]] on reply)</sub> 12:18, 16 June 2025 (UTC)
* While the name of the article reads a bit awkwardly, it does not seem to be a POVFORK of Legitimacy of the State of Israel; to the contrary it seems a much more understandably scoped. And while I'm not familiar at all with the history here, it also doesn't look much like the linked previous version of Calls for the destruction of Israel. There's possible overlap with [[Iran–Israel relations]], but agree with Graeme Bartlett that this seems an understandable sub-article, as a specific article on one aspect of a foreign policy. Perhaps there's a different way to package or rename this, but none of the proposed targets so far work. [[User:Chipmunkdavis|CMD]] ([[User talk:Chipmunkdavis|talk]]) 10:36, 14 June 2025 (UTC)
*:@[[User:Chipmunkdavis|Chipmunkdavis]] I'll explain this more below later today. The history is that for 1 year+ I struggled to understand what is the difference between [[anti-zionism]] (opposition to the existence of Israel), "[[Calls for the destruction of Israel]]" and saying [[Legitimacy of Israel|Israel is not a legitimate entity]] (see [[Talk:Calls_for_the_destruction_of_Israel/Archive_1#How_does_this_article's_scope_differ_from_anti-Zionism?|this discussion]] and [[Talk:Calls_for_the_destruction_of_Israel/Archive_1#POV_coatrack|this one]]). Eventually, after reading a lot of the material I arrived at the conclusion that all of these articles talk about the same idea: that the creation of Israel was unjust. Critics of this idea tend to frame it in a negative way ("destruction of the state of Israel"), whereas proponents of the idea frame it positively ("returning Palestine to its indigenous inhabitants"). If someone had created an article called "[[Undoing the injustices of Zionism]]", I would similarly call it a POVFORK and propose it be merged into [[anti-zionism]] or [[legitimacy of Israel]].'''[[User talk:Vice regent|VR]]''' <sub>(Please [[Template:Ping|ping]] on reply)</sub> 19:35, 14 June 2025 (UTC)
*::But this article topic isn't the general topic of destruction/legitimacy, it's specifically about one country's foreign policy (however accurate or poorly framed it may be), which "Undoing the injustices of Zionism" would not be. [[User:Chipmunkdavis|CMD]] ([[User talk:Chipmunkdavis|talk]]) 23:00, 14 June 2025 (UTC)
*:::@[[User:Chipmunkdavis|Chipmunkdavis]] if its about Iran's foreign policy then makes the scope overlap with [[Iran-Israel relations]]. That is the standard naming convention for foreign policies on wikipedia. The fact that both articles have too similar of a scope makes it a "fork". The "pov" part in "povfork" comes from the fact that its framed not with a neutral POV, but rather with a blatantly pro-Israel/anti-Iranian POV. (BTW, I would be OK with an article called [[Iran-Israel relations (post-1979)]], as such a framing would divide by history and not by POV).'''[[User talk:Vice regent|VR]]''' <sub>(Please [[Template:Ping|ping]] on reply)</sub> 23:38, 14 June 2025 (UTC)
*::::Relations articles do not cover all of foreign policy, and aspects of foreign policy do not make up all of a relationship. The standard convention for foreign policy articles is "Foreign policy of X", but sub-articles have whatever name most suits that topic. [[Open Door Policy]] for example covers a specific aspect of United States policy regarding China, which would not fit into the extremely long [[China–United States relations]]. [[User:Chipmunkdavis|CMD]] ([[User talk:Chipmunkdavis|talk]]) 23:45, 14 June 2025 (UTC)
*:::::Yeah but Open Door Policy is a neutral framing for a split. This is not. See {{U|Berchanhimez}}'s statement.  They were very thorough. [[User:Simonm223|Simonm223]] ([[User talk:Simonm223|talk]]) 10:47, 15 June 2025 (UTC)
*::::::Berchanhimez's statement was after my post was made, and my statement and the questions I raised refer to those made at the time of my post. [[User:Chipmunkdavis|CMD]] ([[User talk:Chipmunkdavis|talk]]) 12:33, 15 June 2025 (UTC)
*:::::::I am aware they commented after you, thus "see below," but the conversation is ongoing and they quite thoroughly rebut the "not a POV Fork" argument. [[User:Simonm223|Simonm223]] ([[User talk:Simonm223|talk]]) 13:15, 15 June 2025 (UTC)
*::::::::Berchanhimez's statement proposes putting information into multiple pages, so it is hard to read that as rebutal of not a POV fork. The page is not a CFORK of any of the pages mentioned, so regardless of how it presents regarding POV (I have suggested another idea above), it is not a POVFORK. [[User:Chipmunkdavis|CMD]] ([[User talk:Chipmunkdavis|talk]]) 13:20, 15 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' article presumes that its stated topic is true, yet while researching another article I found that it's more disputed than pro Israel advocates let on. Specifically as I understand it Iran's stated goal is a one state solution where every resident has an equal vote. To characterize this as "destruction of Israel" (even though some Iranian officials use this kind of rhetoric) is not an unbiased framing. The category "incitement to genocide of Jews" is wholly misplaced because there was never any agreement that this was Iran's goal even back when Ahmedinejad was in office. ([[User talk:Buidhe|t]] &#183; [[Special:Contributions/Buidhe|c]]) '''[[User:buidhe|<span style="color: black">buidhe</span>]]''' 11:48, 14 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' - while contentious, it's accurate and well-sourced. I'm a big opponent of forks, ''except'' where the main article gets so big that it's getting difficult to navigate. A deletion would erase a notable topic and make us appear to countenance the policy; a merger would be unmanageable. [[User:Bearian|Bearian]] ([[User talk:Bearian|talk]]) 15:04, 14 June 2025 (UTC)
*:Well sourced does not mean it gets an article per [[WP:PAGEDECIDE]]. ''[[User:TarnishedPath|<b style="color:#ff0000;">Tar</b><b style="color:#ff7070;">nis</b><b style="color:#ffa0a0;">hed</b><b style="color:#420000;">Path</b>]]''<sup>[[User talk:TarnishedPath|<b style="color:#bd4004;">talk</b>]]</sup> 15:31, 14 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' - Clear-cut POV cruft per several editors above. There is nothing useful for merging the article somewhere else, let alone keeping it. [[User:REDISCOVERBHARAT|REDISCOVERBHARAT]] ([[User talk:REDISCOVERBHARAT|talk]]) 15:41, 14 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' per Czello and CMD. [[User:The Kip|<span style="color:#333f42;">'''The'''</span>]] [[User talk:The Kip|<span style="color:#b4975a;">'''Kip'''</span>]] <span style="color:#C8102E;"><small><sup>([[Special:Contributions/The Kip|contribs]])</sup></small></span> 15:48, 14 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Keep'''. The scope is clear and the topic notable. Any POV issues can be addressed through editing. <span style="white-space: nowrap;">—[[User:Compassionate727|Compassionate727]]&nbsp;<sup>([[User talk:Compassionate727|T]]·[[Special:Contributions/Compassionate727|C]])</sup></span> 19:29, 14 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Delete after giving ample time to merge any useful content not already at destination(s)'''. I would also support it being moved to draft space or a userspace pending those merges rather than leaving it up while merges happen. My reasoning is basically the same as others, mostly POVFORK but I am also very swayed by the arguments of buidhe above regarding how it's basically impossible to treat this topic with the context necessary in a separate page here. That has, as buidhe correctly points out, made it even ''easier'' for this to become a POV pushing page.{{pb}}If after merging and considering [[WP:DUE]] and [[WP:NPOV]] at the destination pages there is a concern for [[WP:ARTICLESIZE|the size of the article]] in question, then splits can be considered from those articles ''through normal split processes'' - not by splitting out one POV like this. To clarify this - ''even if'' there was a valid reason to split some parts of the other article(s) out, ''this'' is not an appropriate way to split for size reasons. -bɜ:ʳkənhɪmez &#124; [[User:berchanhimez|me]] &#124; [[User talk:berchanhimez|talk to me!]] 20:23, 14 June 2025 (UTC)
* '''Keep''' This is a significant and notable part of Iranian policy that they emphasize heavily, so the idea should be kept, but it probably could use a better name. Or possibly merge into [[Death to Israel]], which may have been where that calls for... page should have gone. Its supposed POVness is kindof misleading because the topic. People are quick to think anything related to Israel will be POV, but it is a fact that this is a significant part of Iranian policy. I remember reading in the past few months that Iran had cut back on the Death to America chants I think after Trump was elected. I cant find any sources atm. [[User:Metallurgist|Metallurgist]] ([[User talk:Metallurgist|talk]]) 03:53, 15 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Keep''', it’s a significant enough and relevant enough policy that it deserves an article of its own. I don’t see how it supposedly violates [[WP:NPOV]], the article is well written. [[User:LivLovisa|LivLovisa]] ([[User talk:LivLovisa|talk]]) 06:28, 15 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Keep'''. This article meets the requirements for notability under [[WP:GNG]] via sustained coverage in scholarly and reliable sources. It is not a [[WP:POVFORK]] but a valid sub-article per [[WP:SUMMARYSTYLE]] focusing on Iranian state strategy. Concerns about title or balance should be addressed through editing, not deletion. A merge would obscure relevant depth and minimize a topic that clearly meets Wikipedia’s notability standards. [[User:Whizkin|Whizkin]] ([[User talk:Whizkin|talk]]) 11:23, 15 June 2025 (UTC)

*'''Keep (Oppose)''' The article is not POV pushing, but the nom is an attempt at POV pushing. [[User:Allthemilescombined1|Allthemilescombined1]] ([[User talk:Allthemilescombined1|talk]]) 11:23, 15 June 2025 (UTC)

*'''Keep''' – per Czello and others. The article is undeniably notable in my view, and any POV issues can be handled in the usual way, i.e. editing and discussion. <span style="border: 1px solid red; padding: 2px;">[[User:GhostOfNoMan|GhostOfNoMan]]</span> 12:49, 15 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' After reviewing the pages I think that I do not see any POV forking in this article (if I am blind, please point to me out). I see that the article is well developed so it should not be deleted. Merging is a viable option, but it should be discussed on the talk page if this is going to be kept, but I do not see any convincing argument that would suggest a merge. [[User:ToadetteEdit|ToadetteEdit]] ([[User talk:ToadetteEdit|talk]]) 15:16, 15 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Oppose''', per Graeme Bartlett and Bearian, et al. It's also a minor point that the main page on [[Iran–Israel relations]] is some 130k bytes already, and it is possible that this topic, which is clearly notable, would be subsumed if not otherwise its own standing article. <span style="font-family: serif; letter-spacing: 0.1em"> &mdash; [[User:Javert2113|Javert2113]] ([[User talk:Javert2113|Siarad.]]&#124;[[Special:Contributions/Javert2113|&#164;]])</span> 15:34, 15 June 2025 (UTC)
* '''Oppose''', per Rafi Chazon, KiltedKangaroo and שלומית ליר. This isn't a [[WP:POVFORK]], since it does not ascribe to a particular POV; what it is is a [[WP:SPINOFF]], and that's fine given the breadth of the subject. IR-ILs relations encompass more than just the current regime's policies on Israel, and if there's enough content to fill a separate article on this particular aspect of them (and there clearly is), then we should have one.
: PS: reminding everyone that Israel is the only country for which we have a "legitimacy of the state of..." article, which should be a huge blinking red marker as to what's a POV fork and what isn't. [[User:François Robere|François Robere]] ([[User talk:François Robere|talk]]) 19:30, 15 June 2025 (UTC)

*'''Comment''' I want to repeat what i said to Rafi Chazon, which is that an article being high quality is not inherently a reason to oppose it. [[WP:QUAL|Ideally all articles regardless of how "safe" they are to AFDs are high quality, well researched, coherent and informative articles.]] This article being of high quality as far as i can tell, that Rafi Chazon clearly spent many many hours on this still doesnt personally diswade me from arguing it should be merged with other articles like i argued in my comment, and also if youve kept this in mind and your argument as to why this article should be kept doesnt have to do with it being well refferenced then please do post!
:[[User:AssanEcho|AssanEcho]] ([[User talk:AssanEcho|talk]]) 18:25, 16 June 2025 (UTC)
:* Soft '''Delete''' - While the topic of the article can work (though it would probably be better to slightly expand the scope to anti-Israel positioning in Iranian policy than just the destruction of Israel), that article as it currently is has very little of {{tqq|in Iranian policy}} and is more quotes and statements by various political and military actors. So, on those grounds the article does not currently meet its scope and should be deleted if no one is going to put in the work to rewrite the article. -- [[User:Cdjp1|Cdjp1]] ([[User talk:Cdjp1|talk]]) 18:36, 16 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' or '''merge''' with [[Legitimacy of the State of Israel]] as POVFORK. [[User:Wikisaurus|Wikisaurus]] ([[User talk:Wikisaurus|talk]]) 23:30, 16 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' (which many editors are calling "Oppose"). The topic is notable and sufficiently discrete. This is a unique aspect of relations between nations in the modern era. As for it being a POV fork, this article is not the result of any content disagreement at the articles suggested as merge candidates. It is not surprising and not a reason to delete when new articles about notable topics are created in the wake of an outbreak of war. [[User:Cullen328|Cullen328]] ([[User talk:Cullen328|talk]]) 05:57, 17 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' - as an obvious POVFORK but also per [[WP:COATRACK]]. This article hinges on using a handful of sources to make the argument that Iran is intent on destroying Israel. Then there's a large compilation of [[WP:BADTHINGS]] (mainly antisemitic statements from Iranian leadership) that aren't sufficiently tied back the main subject of the article. Some portions of this may be salvageable and merged into [[Iran–Israel relations]]. [[User:EvansHallBear|EvansHallBear]] ([[User talk:EvansHallBear|talk]]) 07:24, 17 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Keep'''. Article covers a notable topic that aids readers in exploring the current conflict. As explained by Cullen328 above, this is not a content fork as some have contended. [[User:Coretheapple|Coretheapple]] ([[User talk:Coretheapple|talk]]) 13:09, 17 June 2025 (UTC)
* '''Delete''': or '''Merge''' as this is a POVFORK  <span style="text-shadow:#000 0em 0em 1em">[[Special:Contributions/Abo_Yemen|<span style="color:#000">𐩣𐩫𐩧𐩨</span>]]&nbsp;[[User:Abo Yemen|<span style="color:#CD0000">Abo Yemen</span>]] ([[User talk:Abo Yemen|<span style="color:#000">𓃵</span>]])</span> 15:53, 17 June 2025 (UTC) <!--VCB Abo Yemen-->
* '''Comment''' - Looks like a POV fork. Possibly an encyclopedic topic but in dire need of a new title at a minimum. [[Israel in official Iranian state policy]] or something to that effect.  [[User:Carrite|Carrite]] ([[User talk:Carrite|talk]]) 18:43, 17 June 2025 (UTC)
*In case anyone is wondering what is with the slurry of comments here from people who do not regularly participate in AFD: https://www. breitbart .com/tech/2025/06/17/cover-up-wikipedia-editors-propose-deleting-page-on-iran-advocating-for-israels-destruction/ is the answer. [[User:Traumnovelle|Traumnovelle]] ([[User talk:Traumnovelle|talk]]) 21:10, 17 June 2025 (UTC)
*:''"editors on Wikipedia proposed deleting..."'' This is of course true. However, editors on Wikipedia also created and wrote the article. [[User:Gråbergs Gråa Sång|Gråbergs Gråa Sång]] ([[User talk:Gråbergs Gråa Sång|talk]]) 06:18, 18 June 2025 (UTC)
* '''Keep/Oppose''' There is no POV pushed here, much less one against consensus; nobody disputes the fact that Iran - both hardliners and reformists - wants to destroy Israel. Furthermore, this subject has been discussed extensively by academic and media sources. [[User:Closetside|Closetside]] ([[User talk:Closetside|talk]]) 21:51, 17 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' - Any further edits should be neutrally aligned. This article is very notable. [[User:Ahri Boy|Ahri Boy]] ([[User talk:Ahri Boy|talk]]) 01:59, 18 June 2025 (UTC)
* '''Merge''' per [[WP:REDUNDANTFORK]]. This stuff is separately covered in other Iran–Israel articles. [[User:FujaFula|FujaFula]] ([[User talk:FujaFula|talk]]) 02:12, 18 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Merge or delete''' with content being merged into either [[Legitimacy of the State of Israel]] or [[Iran-Israel relations]] per the outcome of [[Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Calls for the destruction of Israel (2nd nomination)]]. Yes, this topic is notable, but it is already covered on Wikipedia. This is a classic case of a [[WP:POVFORK]]. I think keep/oppose !votes which ''only'' address whether or not the topic is notable enough for Wikipedia are missing the point a little. This is a worse version of pages that already exist. Per EvansHallBear's !vote above, [[WP:COATRACK]] and [[WP:BADTHINGS]] apply as well. I'm in favor of merging any salvageable bytes and deleting whatever is left behind, no firm opinion one way or the other on leaving behind a redirect since redirects are cheap and are often allowed to have POV titles to a degree. <b style="font-family:Trebuchet MS">[[User:Vanilla Wizard|<b style="background-color:#07d;color:#FFF">&nbsp;Vanilla </b>]][[User Talk:Vanilla Wizard|<b style="background-color:#749;color:#FFF">&nbsp;Wizard </b>]]</b> [[Special:Contribs/Vanilla Wizard|💙]] 16:29, 18 June 2025 (UTC)
*:I also wanted to mention that this article is strikingly similar to the problematic "Background" section that used to be in the article about the June 2025 Israeli strikes on Iran article before that whole section got purged and was rewritten from scratch because the old one was a COATRACK. This article is mostly just a compilation of every offensive statement any Iranian official ever made, either in government or in the military, every time someone said something along the lines of "Israel, your days are numbered", some version of "God will destroy Israel", or antisemitic phrases to say the same thing. Would such a page exist for any other bitter rivalry or armed conflict? I consider myself to be a hardcore supporter of Ukraine, but if an article were just a list of Russians saying about a hundred different versions of "time's running out for Ukraine, you are a fake country and we will destroy you", even I would have to agree that's a bad excuse for an article and it would have to be deleted. I also have a feeling it wouldn't be difficult to make such a compilation of every time an IDF member or Israeli government official made offensive or dehumanizing remarks about Palestinians, but I have a feeling not many would support that being an article, either. In any conflict like this, there's an ocean of bitter and hateful comments to be found. The president of Azerbaijan has repeatedly called Armenia a fascist state that needs to be destroyed. Should we make an article out of that? No, we need less coatracks, not more. <b style="font-family:Trebuchet MS">[[User:Vanilla Wizard|<b style="background-color:#07d;color:#FFF">&nbsp;Vanilla </b>]][[User Talk:Vanilla Wizard|<b style="background-color:#749;color:#FFF">&nbsp;Wizard </b>]]</b> [[Special:Contribs/Vanilla Wizard|💙]] 16:56, 18 June 2025 (UTC)
*::Well said. [[User:Bagabondo|Bagabondo]] ([[User talk:Bagabondo|talk]]) 21:02, 21 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Merge/Delete'''' per Vanilla Wizard. Also infringes [[WP:NPOV]]. --[[User:MikutoH|<span style="color: #be1918;">'''MikutoH'''</span>]] [[User talk:MikutoH|<sup><span style="color:#ee8b39;"> '''talk!''' </span></sup>]] 23:54, 18 June 2025 (UTC)
* '''Keep'''. For better or worse, this topic has sparked significant debate over the years, as reflected in the sources. I fully understand how some editors [[WP:LIKEIT]] and others [[WP:DONTLIKEIT]], but we should assess notability objectively. In this case, the article clearly meets the [[WP:GNG]], with no conflict with [[WP:NOT]]. There’s absolutely no reason objectivity and a fair summary of the sources can’t go hand in hand. I’m big on merges, but the article is too big for [[Legitimacy of the State of Israel]], so that’s not an option here. [[User:Gidonb|gidonb]] ([[User talk:Gidonb|talk]]) 01:56, 19 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Merge''' A classic example of a [[WP:POVFORK]]. According to a finding in the recent ArbCom case [[Wikipedia:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Palestine-Israel articles 5]] {{tq|When the status quo version of an existing article does not match an editor's preferred version or point of view and attempts to change it are reverted, new articles describing the same subject from a different point of view ("POV forks") are often created [in the Israel-Palestine topic area].}} The subject of this article can be entirely handed in the [[Legitimacy of the State of Israel]] and the [[Iran–Israel relations]] articles.  [[User:Hemiauchenia|Hemiauchenia]] ([[User talk:Hemiauchenia|talk]]) 10:49, 19 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' There is no pov and the article is to big for [[Legitimacy of the State of Israel]]. [[User:Shadow4dark|Shadow4dark]] ([[User talk:Shadow4dark|talk]]) 13:41, 19 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Delete/Merge''' It is undoubtedly a POVFORK. [[Legitimacy of the State of Israel]] is certainly enough for this subject. [[User:Azuredivay|Azuredivay]] ([[User talk:Azuredivay|talk]]) 19:46, 19 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Merge''' - transparent [[WP:POVFORK]]. [[User:Bluethricecreamman|Bluethricecreamman]] ([[User talk:Bluethricecreamman|talk]]) 23:22, 19 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' per [[WP:POVFORK]] but much of the content would be useful in another article. [[User:The Knowledge Pirate|The Knowledge Pirate]] ([[User talk:The Knowledge Pirate|talk]]) 01:51, 20 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' There are dozens and dozens of sources such as [https://apnews.com/article/a033042303545d9ef783a95222d51b83 "Iran leader says Israel a ‘cancerous tumor’ to be destroyed"] from the [[Associated Press]] of Iranian leaders -- as well as the dozens of others listed by other editors above -- demonstrating that this is a fundamental aspect of national policy that goes far beyond questioning the legitimacy of Israel, and this fact is demonstrated beyond a shadow of a doubt with the more than 50 sources in the article. The existence of these sources demonstrate that the [[WP:GNG|general notability guideline has been satisfied]] as well as proving that this is not "a [[WP:POVFORK]] of [[Legitimacy of the State of Israel]]" as the nominator has claimed without any evidence. [[User:Alansohn|Alansohn]] ([[User talk:Alansohn|talk]]) 20:07, 20 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' Per Alansohn and others. This seems a fundamental aspect of Iranian policy, widely covered.--[[User:Wehwalt|Wehwalt]] ([[User talk:Wehwalt|talk]]) 21:24, 20 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Merge''' as a clear [[WP:POVFORK]], which is a persistent problem in this topic area. The article's content can be adequately covered at [[Iran–Israel relations]]. [[User:Day Creature|Day Creature]] ([[User talk:Day Creature|talk]]) 21:34, 20 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Merge''' to [[Iran–Israel relations]]. Blatant [[WP:POVFORK]], [[User:Huldra|Huldra]] ([[User talk:Huldra|talk]]) 22:35, 20 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Rename''' à la [[United States foreign policy toward the People's Republic of China]]. Not everything can be fit into [[Iran-Israel relations]]. Can either make the article about the Islamic Republic of Iran or just Iran. The latter option would require expanding the article somewhat, so the former is the most straightforward (i.e. something like [[Foreign policy of the Islamic Republic of Iran toward Israel]]). However, for [[WP:NPOV]], any retained edition ought to amply reference any relevant pages so as not to violate the policy e.g. by "omission", as this article is necesarily about one side/direction like the U.S. article. [[User:Rethliopuks|Rethliopuks]] ([[User talk:Rethliopuks|talk]]) 23:06, 20 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Merge''' Could easily belong within [[Legitimacy of the State of Israel]]; however, it is quite lengthy and well sourced, so that effort may need to be handled cautiously to ensure important information is not lost during the downsizing. [[User:Fdssdf|Fdssdf]] ([[User talk:Fdssdf|talk]]) 01:49, 21 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Delete''' It's a[[WP:POVFORK]].[[User:GolsaGolsa|GolsaGolsa]] ([[User talk:GolsaGolsa|talk]]) 12:06, 21 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' - the article includes factual statements, much of which is extremely important for readers to know. It's as important as what happened during Hitler's reign, and any attempt to bury it by deletion or merging speaks volumes to the importance of keeping it. [[User:Atsme|<span style="text-shadow:#F8F8FF 0.2em 0.2em 0.2em,#F4BBFF -0.2em -0.2em 0.2em,#BFFF00 0.4em 0.4em 0.5em;color:#A2006D"><small>Atsme</small></span>]] [[User talk:Atsme|💬]] [[Special:EmailUser/Atsme|📧]] 15:25, 21 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''keep''' It is well-sourced and not OR. Nor is it a POVFORK since there is more than enough neutral material for this to be a separate article than the article about the legitimacy of the state of Israel. It also isn't the same topic; the current Iranian regimes attitude about the destruction of the state of Israel is a separate topic from the state of Israel. It is a subtopic of Iran-Israel relations, but there's enough clear material here for a separate article. [[User:JoshuaZ|JoshuaZ]] ([[User talk:JoshuaZ|talk]]) 17:22, 21 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Keep''' but '''rename''' to [[Foreign policy of the Islamic Republic of Iran toward Israel]] per Rethliopuks. The modern Iranian state's policy towards Israel is certainly a notable topic independent from [[Iran–Israel relations]], and I think a rename would get around the [[WP:POVFORK]] issues by broadening its scope beyond collecting statements from Iranian leaders that they hope there's a second Holocaust, which I think runs afoul of [[WP:COATRACK]]. [[User:TheJoebro64|<small style="color:red">JOE</small>]][[User talk:TheJoebro64|<small>BRO</small>]][[Special:Contributions/TheJoebro64|<sup style="color:#D18719">64</sup>]] 18:09, 21 June 2025 (UTC)
*'''Keep/Oppose/Rename'''. This clearly is a distinct, notable subject from general Israel-Iran relations. A rename to "Foreign policy of the Islamic Republic of Iran toward Israel" might be warranted to avoid POV issues, but given that the vast majority of that foreign policy is an explicitly stated, repeatedly clearly reiterated intention to destroy Israel, the current name doesn't really violate POV. It is still an independently notable subject given that it's a driving force between half a dozen regional conflicts, it's a core element in the Israel-Iran proxy war, it is the motivation behind the ostensible Iranian nuclear weapons project which inspired Israeli and possible US action. Failing to have a Wikipedia page on this subject is an abdication of responsibility and neutrality. This is an actual notable decades old policy. Specific government policies have Wikipedia pages all the time, such as [[Wet feet, dry feet policy]], [[One China]], [[One-child policy]]... In this region, there are even pages for hypothetical, unimplemented policies of note such as [[Proposed Israeli annexation of the West Bank]]. [[User:Jbbdude|Jbbdude]] ([[User talk:Jbbdude|talk]]) 22:58, 21 June 2025 (UTC)
* '''Merge''' to [[Iran–Israel relations]] and/or [[Legitimacy of the State of Israel]] as a POVFORK. [[User:Isi96|Isi96]] ([[User talk:Isi96|talk]]) 00:14, 22 June 2025 (UTC)
* '''Merge''' Skimming through the article I don't understand how most of the sources directly support the claims in the article, besides Iranian leaders wanting Israel to disappear or saying it shouldn't exist or saying it will undoubtedly disappear which to me sounds like opinion or statements made to increase popularity. Executing such a plan to eliminate Israel would require coordination, so with such a title, I'd expect to see direct evidence such as sources discussing Iranian government plans or laws or decrees. I can't find them. Some of the references mention Gaza, Hamas which are undesirable in Israel and this was made in the middle of a conflict so I am concerned about objectivity. The US is a strong supporter of Israel and there doesn't seem to be any non-US sources being used for major claims in the article. I find this article as being strongly pro-Israel rather than being neutral. I am also concerned about most opposing opinions here since I think they don't take Wikipedia policy into account and I haven't seen such a thing before. I live in a country where Israelis own media companies, all large department store chains and can afford to run, and have run multi page newspaper inserts and long, widespread PR pieces so maybe that's why I am concerned. [[User:Pancho507|Pancho507]] ([[User talk:Pancho507|talk]]) 01:25, 22 June 2025 (UTC)
{{clear}}
:''The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. <b style="color:var(--color-error, red)">Please do not modify it.</b> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's [[Help:Talk pages|talk page]] or in a [[Wikipedia:Deletion review|deletion review]]). No further edits should be made to this page.''<!--Template:Afd bottom--></div>