Wikipedia talk:Naming conventions (people)

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Hello to all. In the article Markos Botsaris a group of users are guarding a "Native name: Marko Boçari" in the infobox. I see that the "native name" is not a standard in the infoboxes in the english WP. Even articles on Chinese persons do not include such an information (e.g. see Mao Zedong, Jiang Kanghu). In the case of Markos Botsaris the supposed "native name" does not offer any info to the reader, since its pronunciation is practically the same with the title of the article. So, here are few questions that may apply to other similar articles and cases:

a) What exactly is a "native name", and when such info should be included in the infobox?

b) Can a "native name" be written in a script that did not exist at the time the person lived, and is not attested at his time?

c) Can a "native name" in english WP be in a script that is non-english? (in this case a letter ç ).

Skylax30 (talk) 20:40, 15 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I don't have a strong opinion on all of this, but the idea in c) that including a diacritic makes it "in a script that is non-English" is bogus. WP (in English) routinely uses diacritics in names that should have them. A "wikiproject" that consisted largely of pushing an anti-diacritics agenda was shut down by the community. So, "don't go there". Your point b), that sounds like

WP:OR. But I don't presently have a good idea for a), how to (in naming conventions guideline or template documentation wording) codify exactly what |native_name= encompasses and does not encompass. It is worth discussion though.  — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼  13:35, 16 August 2023 (UTC)[reply

]

• Luvsannamsrain Oyun-Erdene (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)

Two questions have been raised about the name used in the article. The first is that the patronymic appears to be in genitive form; I see the print sources using "Luvsannamsrai" instead.

The bigger question is about name order. Do we have a standing guideline for Mongolian names? It looks like the article's English-language sources split on which name is presented first. —C.Fred (talk) 02:09, 9 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/speeches-remarks/2023/08/02/remarks-by-vice-president-harris-and-prime-minister-oyun-erdene-luvsannamsrai-of-mongolia/ you can take it as the most reliable source on the matter. Gologmine (talk) 02:17, 9 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@Gologmine So, use the patronymic on second reference in the article? For instance, rewrite the first sentence of Education and early career as Luvsannamsrai then graduated from Harvard University in 2015 with a master's degree in Public Policy? Because that's what that White House briefing does. —C.Fred (talk) 02:21, 9 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Looking closer at the sources in the article, the sources that use "Luvsannamsrai Oyun-Erdene" tend to be published in Asia (South Korea, China, etc.), and the ones that use "Oyun-Erdene Luvsannamsrai" are wire services and other sources from Europe and the Americas. —C.Fred (talk) 02:23, 9 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Japanese for example use their last name in front. In fact Asians use their last name in the front. Xi Jing Ping, Shinzo Abe etc. Japanese animes change their character names postion for example in Japan its Uzamki Naruto, but in Europe or in America its Naruto Uzumaki etc. Mongolian is bit different. We use extra genitve trailing such as "n", "iin", "giin". Gologmine (talk) 02:27, 9 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Napoleon's article is currently titled