User talk:Gadget850/Archive 2006

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WE DID IT!. IT'S A FEATURED ARTICLE!!!! THANKS TO EVERYONE THAT HELPED!! YEAH!!!Rlevse 18:45, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

This section was moved to our new WikiProject page, participants section:
Wikipedia:WikiProject_Scouting#Participants_and_primary_areas_of_interest

Please go there and look over our new WikiProject and update your primary areas of interest (I guessed based on what I knew of you).

I will be moving the rest of this page over to the WikiProject shortly.

We really need more people outside BSA involved in our project. Please let them know if you know of anyone who may be interested. Rlevse 13:11, 20 January 2006 (UTC)

Create a WikiProject --Ed 16:56, 13 January 2006 (UTC)

Or a WikiCollaboration. I can see either one. Rlevse 17:44, 13 January 2006 (UTC)

I'm all for a WikiProject Scouting, but one that's more inclusive than the BSA - make the BSA into a sub project, get some ladies to contribute to

18:32, 13 January 2006 (UTC)

Scouting portal

If you go to the Stargate SG-1 article, there is a portal link, if you go to the Morocco article, there is a portal link, there are now a great number of Scouting articles of all varieties, would a portal for Scouting be a good idea? Thanks Chris 23:12, 13 January 2006 (UTC)

Here is the link of all the current portals that exist on Wikipedia. Does everyone thinks it would be an appropriate addition to the ones listed there? Also, see Wikipedia:Portal#How_to_create_a_new_portal --Naha|^(talk)

23:48, 13 January 2006 (UTC)

This has definite possibilities. The question would be the scope...my main concern is whether we can get enough users knowledgeable about Scouting outside of the USA to work the non-BSA topics. Of the people on our list so far, I think (not sure) only two fall into that category (Jergen and Kintetsubuffalo). Rlevse 23:54, 13 January 2006 (UTC)

Well, there's certainly an expert on Polish Scouts here somewhere:

02:13, 14 January 2006 (UTC)

True, I'm sure they're out there, but I was referring the users currently listed in the "Interested Wikipedians" section of this page. Rlevse 02:22, 14 January 2006 (UTC)

VOTE

Here's my vote for the type and scope of this:

a Scouting Portal (not project or collaboration)

there are 4

Wikipedia:Portal/Directory. If people want, I'll start the portal and be the coordinator. If people prefer otherwise and/or someone else wants to do it, that's fine too. So far, most of us seem interested in this are Americans, so I see the BSA section getting the most work --in the beginnings at least, but there are others who can and desire to work on Scouting and Guiding in other countries. We should call it Portal:Scouting or Portal:Scouting and Guiding. Portals can have projects associated with them. One option is to have a portal with projects under it such as BSA, Scouting in Europe, Scouting in Asia, etc. I'd also like feedback on when to kick this off. YIS, Randy Rlevse

17:19, 17 January 2006 (UTC)

Support - I like the layout of both of the ones you have chosen. This sounds like a good proposal, I'm all for it! Also, I think the title should just be "Scouting" as opposed to "Scouting and Guiding." --Naha|^(talk) 21:19, 17 January 2006 (UTC)

Project & Portal status

Project creation in progess as of 19 Jan 06.

I have made the

13:18, 20 January 2006 (UTC)

Language moved

This has been moved to

16:56, 20 January 2006 (UTC)

Article titles moved

This has been moved to

16:56, 20 January 2006 (UTC)

Articles surprisingly missing that we need moved

This section has been moved to: Wikipedia:WikiProject_Scouting/Todo

This has been moved to the talk page of RulesStandards:

NOTE: We need to settle how to do this. My feeling is there's not a consensus. Rlevse 17:23, 20 January 2006 (UTC)

This has been moved to

16:56, 20 January 2006 (UTC)

References, footnotes, etc moved

This has been moved to

Wikipedia:WikiProject Scouting/RulesStandards

Standard end of articles moved

This has been moved to

note userbox negativity

Folks, go to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Userboxes/Interests and scroll down to that new userbox, the World Badge with the slash across it. Does that not seem to be a slam on Scouting, as per "All items in template space are governed by the civility policy." on Wikipedia:Userboxes#How to make a Userbox? I have posted a request for explanation at User talk:Alex43223.

Further, because not all Scouts are members of WOSM or WAGGGS, I've created a related userbox template that is non-specific to any organization.

(ps-I used a defunct and generic Scout fleur-de-lis so as to avoid any trouble with copyright, just like they did for the bald eagle rather than the badge for the Eagle Scout userbox)

What do you think? And if there is a way to incorporate a Girl Guide trefoil, that's great!

Chris 03:01, 15 January 2006 (UTC)

I don't know about the civility policy, but I always thought "Once a Scout, always a Scout" (assuming you were not kicked out for some sort of misbehavior or something). So, I'm not sure why they feel the need to differentiate between "Scout" and "Former Scout" with 2 different userboxes? I do like your new box though :) --Naha|^(talk) 06:40, 15 January 2006 (UTC)

Chris, good catch on the userbox with the 'no' symbol. I can see where some would think it's anti-Scouting and where some it may possibly mean 'I was registered as a Scout, but am not registered now'. I am glad you asked for clarification. I think if it means 'I'm not registered now', the symbol should be redone. Yes, the tone should be civil, and yes, Naha, the vast majority of Scouts always have Scouting with them in some way.

Chris: have you thought of moving your two userboxs into the main wiki section? Rlevse 12:39, 15 January 2006 (UTC)

I have also asked for clarification also on the

templates for deletion to help reach a consensus on what to do." Chris

20:46, 15 January 2006 (UTC)

Randy, if you want to pull them out of my workshop and put them in an appropriate Wiki section, please do. I'm not entirely sure how to or where to. Note-I can't find the Eagle Scout one's location. Note also my two boxes predate the circle-and-slash variant. Chris 16:57, 15 January 2006 (UTC)

Chris, I've made userboxes and templates out of your workshop templates. They are called "Template:User ScoutGuide" ("User Scout" was taken by ...) and "Template:User ScoutTrade". You may or may not want to delete your workshop stuff. I'll notify users linked to them they should change to the userboxes. Randy, 19:44, 15 January 2006 (UTC)

It's fixed, he meant no offense, we can cut out most of this section if it's too bulky, now. Chris 05:53, 16 January 2006 (UTC)

Okay, the original creator of the userbox may have meant no offense, but now there is a whole other issue going on at Template talk:User Scout-former. I am not going to argue BSA policy with anyone, that's not why I'm here, but I think the userbox seriously needs to pick a side, if it is against Scouting, it needs openly to say so. If it isn't, it needs to ditch the negative graphic that has once again been put back on the box. Chris 01:47, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

While not directly related to this article, I thought this was the best place to announce this, so please bear with me. I've created a "Wood Badger Wikipedians" category and userbox (I'm a 3-bead Wood Badger). You can just place that category on your user page if you want or add the userbox to your userbox list, which will also add you to the category. See my userpage for an example if you like. The userbox is in the Interests listing of userboxes because that's where the Scouting one is. While I use the Eagle Scout userbox, I can't find it in the userbox listings. Does anyone know it is listed? I may move the Wood Badger one there?Rlevse 14:27, 15 January 2006 (UTC)

More userboxes

There are two other user boxes now (moved from Chris' workshop); one called "Template:User ScoutGuide" and one called "Template:User ScoutTrade". See my userpage for samples. They are listed in the Userbox/Interest/Outdoor section of the userbox listings.Rlevse 21:45, 15 January 2006 (UTC)

Looks like some merging needs to happen. We have two article about the same thing:

21:32, 17 January 2006 (UTC)

I need a nap. These are not the same articles. Sorry. Nothing to see here, move along... --Naha|^(talk) 21:35, 17 January 2006 (UTC)

This has been moved to

16:56, 20 January 2006 (UTC)

Scoutpedia, The Scouting Encyclopedia

On the Scouting main article, there is a link for

• Scoutpedia, The Scouting Encyclopedia

but when I clicked on it, I got "Database error From Scoutpedia A database query syntax error has occurred. This may indicate a bug in the software. The last attempted database query was: (SQL query hidden) from within function "LinkCache::addLinkObj". MySQL returned error "1016: Can't open file: 'page.ibd' (errno: 1) (localhost)"." Can anyone else get into it, and what is it precisely? Chris 21:03, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

I got the same error. Rlevse 13:15, 20 January 2006 (UTC)

---

I've worked out a similar error and some solutions. Check my notes page see if that helps. http://notes.homelinux.org/index.php/Software/Wiki/Errors . --Iain 21:21, 18 February 2006 (UTC)

---

Did you see this proposal? Scouting Barnstarn --evrik 20:46, 24 January 2006 (UTC)

On one of the BSA-related pages, I think one of the ones dealing with Eagle Scouts, you said "Scout" should only be capitalized when it's part of a title or rank. So, would you agree that the articles dealing with ranks (which are all named in the same pattern) should be renamed from "(rank) scout (Boy Scouts of America)" to "(rank) Scout (Boy Scouts of America), etc.? Also, would you say in a sentence like " A Scout can earn....." that Scout should or should not be capitalized? Rlevse 13:56, 5 January 2006 (UTC)

I would use "Scout" to refer to any member of the Scouting movement. English-speaking countries consider Scouting a proper noun. I'd consider any country with a recognized Scouting movement a Scout. Since Scouting, is UC; I'd UC Scout in this context, Eagle Scout, Queen Scout, Boy Scout, etc. Capitalizing Scouting but not Scout does not make sense. LC scout could refer to an Army scout, be a verb, or an activity. If we ever get a WikiProject or WikiCollaboration going, we'd need to be consistent. Thanks for the input. Rlevse 18:51, 5 January 2006 (UTC)

So does this mean we should rename all the rank articles "(Rank) Scout..." from "(Rank) scout...". We likely need to get a WikiProject or WikiCollabaration going soon, as JohnDBuell and Rebelguys2 have suggested.Rlevse 21:25, 11 January 2006 (UTC)

Gadget: I saw you fixed the note/correction I made to the Henry Fonda artcle (which I don't mind at all), but both when I made it yesterday and after you worked on it, it makes the ref number in the text "3", but in the footnotes, it's a "1". I'm having trouble making the numbers match up. Can you help with this? Also, what does 'dab' mean in the history note you entered? Rlevse 12:56, 8 January 2006 (UTC)

Tks. I agree, let someone really interested in Fonda fix the note/ref numbers. I've been fixing lots of Eagle Scout dabs too. So, the number problem is inherent to wiki and people not being consistent, huh. Did you notice this is an FA? Rlevse 13:25, 8 January 2006 (UTC)

Hm, but mixing them causes problems, as you pointed out. And putting them in Ref section with links (such ref the ref/note system) seems to work better. Rlevse 18:25, 10 January 2006 (UTC)

There's been talk of it on various talk pages and the MB acrticle FAC. User:JohnDBuell proposed a WikiProject and User:Rebelguys2 proposed a WikiCollaboration (I'm not sure of the difference). The consensus on the MB FAC page was to get that article to FA, then start the project/collab. Rebelguys2 said he'd do the copyedit and title change of the article and that's what we're waiting on now. Rlevse 15:48, 13 January 2006 (UTC)

Gadget850: User:Grazon took out Brescia again from the Eagles list. I'm about to tell him off. I personally don't care if Brescia is on it or not. What I do care about is the edit war he's starting and him not heeding the criterion that's agreed to on the talk page. One more time and I will get on him. At the last second, I thought for this time I'd tell you. Thanks for your work on the Scouting articles. Rlevse 22:54, 13 January 2006 (UTC)

Chris asked me to make regular userboxes out of the ones he has in his workshop, which you are using. To change to the Wiki userbox (which is exactly the same, but now part of Wiki proper and not his workshop), add the {{User ScoutGuide}} box to your page. There is also a {{User ScoutTrade}} one for collectors. Both are in the userbox [category]. These will add you to appropriate categories too. See my user page for an example. I also made a {{User Wood Badger}} userbox. Rlevse 20:01, 15 January 2006 (UTC)

Ed: take a look at Category:Wood Badger Wikipedians and look at the edit war User:Silence started. I left a note on his talk page. What do you make of this? I don't see the rationale. He did this to the Eagle Scout cat too. Rlevse 19:00, 18 January 2006 (UTC)

Did you see this proposal? Scouting Barnstarn --evrik 19:50, 24 January 2006 (UTC)

Scouting Barnstar - Where to put it?

I believe that the award that was created for the Scouting Barnstar should be a topical award. Scouting is a world-wide movement that has served youth in many countries for more than 100 years and represents the youth of the world at the United Nations.

It has been suggested that the award be given as a PUA. The first line on the PUA page reads, "This page provides a collection of awards created by individual Wikipedians." The Scouting Barnstar was created by the WikiProject Scouting.

Currently, the is a discussion going on at

Category:Scouting

BSA is not listed as a sub category of Scouting, although I agree it should be. --Bduke 12:42, 25 January 2006 (UTC)

Non of the national org articles are sub cats of Scouting, they are in WOSM, WAGGGS, " or "Non-aligned Scouting organizations".

The BSA category is a sub of "Scouting by country", as are all the country categories.Rlevse 22:24, 26 January 2006 (UTC)

I have now completed the transition from state list to articles on Scouting in each state, as per

09:22, 28 January 2006 (UTC)

Ranks

Ed: See my last comment on the rank article issue. Are you ready and willing to proceed? Rlevse 21:04, 26 January 2006 (UTC), Randy

Please see Wikipedia:Categories_for_deletion/Log/2006_January_27#.5B.5B:Category:Boy_Scouts_of_America_controversy.5D.5D_and_.5B.5B:Category:Boy_Scouts_of_America_controversies.5D.5D_to_.28he_didn.27t_say_what.29 and comment on the two listing on Scouting categories. Rlevse 13:08, 28 January 2006 (UTC)

Ed: Very good on both sandboxes! Are you going to do this before, after or in conjunction with the rank and recognition series? I left comments in the boxes. Rlevse 02:41, 2 February 2006 (UTC)

Hi, see if my most recent edit helped. The error was inadvertent. Squamate 17:15, 7 February 2006 (UTC)

Ed: I'm not sure what you meant by the Eagle mentor pin being new. It's been around since at least early 2004., YIS, Randy Rlevse 16:22, 9 February 2006 (UTC) PS: Great work going on with the Advancement articles!

You are right- it was introduced in 2004. We did not have any Eagles last year (only year in the 12 I've been with this troop, and we should have 6 this year), so it was new to me, and I just stumbled across it.

And thanks. I must admit to an ulterior motive on

. Since I'm the scribe for the next Wood Badge course here, the first issue of the Gilwell Gazette is going to have a history of Cub Scouts. The next will have a Boy Scout history and the fifth will be Venturing. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 16:47, 9 February 2006 (UTC)

I was Scribe for the last WB course we had, in Fall 2005. I had a Scout Trivia section in the Gazette. I also teach our History of Scouting class at our Univ. of Scouting. Rlevse 16:56, 9 February 2006 (UTC)

Ed: I switched the project and portal to the GIF format and they look fine. However, when I do that to the userboxes, they just don't look right to me. Can you look into this? How is the rank restructuring going? Tks, YIS, Randy Rlevse 15:58, 21 February 2006 (UTC)

PS: maybe we should change the image border color to the same as the project tag. Rlevse 16:44, 21 February 2006 (UTC)

I noticed that the Varsity Scouts article had essentially the same text as a previous version of the BSA Requirements. I had updated that article extensively last week, and added images today. I copied the text over into the advancement section. What else can I be of help with? NThurston 22:45, 22 February 2006 (UTC)

I am not planning on making any major additions to the content at this point. I like what you have done to the formatting. I do think the five program areas of emphasis need to figure prominently, as they are the basis for Varsity Scouting. The rest of my edits have been copy editing. NThurston 15:36, 8 March 2006 (UTC)

Yes, mostly style differences. I am ok either way, except I think that there needs to be a way to emphasize the five program areas of emphasis. I agree that === wasn't the best idea. I kind of liked how * worked, though. I'll look at the other pages to see if I can find some common ground that doesn't cause the information to get washed out of context. Please check back later to see if you like what I end up proposing.NThurston 15:53, 8 March 2006 (UTC)

I looked at the troop level page you propose, and basically it's fine. I wonder where you would include the "program" descriptions, such as Aims and Methods and things like that. NThurston 15:56, 8 March 2006 (UTC)

Aims are already in the lead-in. Activities is changing to program and activities across the series. Do you have anything on the initial numbers on Varsity Scouts are like I have in the lead-in on

16:03, 8 March 2006 (UTC)

I don't have any numbers, yet. But I will scout around for them, pun intended. NThurston 21:06, 8 March 2006 (UTC)

I moved the portal below the image. See if you can get the body text equal to the logo, it doesn't look good starting so far down. I'm swamped this week, so leave the peer review up until at least next Monday. Feel free to remind me again next Monday. I'll work on it as best I can. Rlevse 17:09, 27 February 2006 (UTC)

I resized it: it does look better now. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 17:38, 27 February 2006 (UTC)

I did a run through with several edits. I'll look more later. You'll need lots of different-sourced footnotes if you want this to be a FA. Rlevse 16:52, 28 February 2006 (UTC)

Looks good. I reverted some of the pack caps though; pack is only capped when referring to a specific unit or program. See Language of Scouting --Gadget850 ( Ed) 17:49, 28 February 2006 (UTC)

Hmmm.... leader titles are not capped either unless as part of an award or part of the program. Thus den chief and Den Chief Award; but Scoutmaster and Cubmaster. Also see the entry on [capitalization --Gadget850 ( Ed) 17:53, 28 February 2006 (UTC)

I looked this over again. Nothing leaps out at me except there're only two footnotes, which is only an issue if you want to make it an FA. Also, the footnote/ref standards are always changing, so that's a crapshoot to predict until the point you submit for FAC. I still like the ref/note system. Rlevse 19:51, 6 March 2006 (UTC)

• 
  A hearty thank you for all of your hard work on Scouting articles, especially on reorganizing BSA advancements. Keep up the fine work!

Rlevse 13:24, 1 March 2006 (UTC)

Hey, I notice your intrested in Kandersteg International Scout Centre from the WikiProject Scouting page! Are you Ex-Staff or Member of the Association? Or are you just a Regualar Guest who loves the place?!!! Ablaze 15:19, 7 March 2006 (UTC)

During my army career, I lived in Neu-Ulm, Germany for six years. I was in the Alpine District of the

16:00, 7 March 2006 (UTC)

I'm Ex-Staff from 2003 and 04! I know all about the Klondike Weeks and TAC! Excellent to find another peoson who has such an intrest in KISC! Ablaze 20:18, 7 March 2006 (UTC)

Cool. I was last in germany from 1985-89. - Ed

I'm not sure if it's a good idea to even have this article.

A disturbing # of people out there hate the BSA and they would love to add bad people to this sort of list in an attempt to discredit scouting.

To make maters worse lots "special news reports" on shows like Nightline start off horrible stories about bad people by telling us they were once in cub scouts to help create a sense of he-was-once-normal-WTF-happend? and since it's easier to molest a kid than it is to be a Congressman the # of sickos will be greater than the # that turned out better than normal.

What do you think? {unsigned by Grazon}

I have a feeling it's not going to go much beyond a stub and will get deleted. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 08:55, 9 March 2006 (UTC)

Ok

PS sorry I didn't sign the first time grazon 23:59, 13 March 2006 (UTC)

Thank you for your reorganization work on the Boy Scouts of America article. Please let me know if there is anything I can do to support your efforts. I'll keep an eye out and try to jump in if the opportunity presents itself. GreggHilferding 04:42, 11 March 2006 (UTC)

Take a look at the new Cite.php footnote style at

21:36, 10 March 2006 (UTC)

I HATE cite php because it makes reading the article while in edit mode difficult and awkward. I saw you'd changed the West article. While I detest this method and the guides still say you can use ref/note, the wind is obviously blowing in the direction of cite php (look at all the recent FA candidates and FAs -- most use php); so I've been debating what to do about it and if it's worth me sticking with ref/note. For anything we try to get to FA, we should probably use it, but one is also not required to change old articles--such as there is no requirement to change my FA on merit badges and I don't intend to. Do you desire to make something FA? Thoughts? Rlevse 11:51, 11 March 2006 (UTC)

I don't see it as a requirement for FA, and it may not be that useful for articles with only a few notes. It would really shine with an article with a lot of notes that are used multiple times since you can create ids.--Gadget850 ( Ed) 12:59, 11 March 2006 (UTC)

You can create ids with ref/note too, just type them. My reference to FA/FAC is merely that cite is what the vast majority are using now. I'm still undecided on this except that I still hate having to jump over references in the middle of text when editing. Rlevse 14:11, 11 March 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for your advice

02:12, 12 March 2006 (UTC)

No problem: just pay it forward. Did I note the problem with the article title? Compare it to the other camps. I just remove dCategory:Boy Scouts of America as Category:Boy Scout reservations is a subcategory therof. I have made a proposal to rename Category:Boy Scout reservations: see Category talk:Boy Scout reservations. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 14:32, 12 March 2006 (UTC)

Yes, I have read the LOS, which is why I didn't go back and change anything. I just don't agree with their cap rules. For instance, to me it should be Junior Assistant Scoutmaster, not junior assistant Scoutmaster, etc. --Emb021 20:13, 17 March 2006 (UTC)

I've got to go with Emb021 on this one. "Patrol Leader", "Junior Assistant Scoutmaster", and all unit jobs (youth or adult) are titles of specific jobs and as such should be capitalized. Not capitalizing them makes it look like a generic phrase; it's like not capitalizing Systems Engineer on a business card. I know it says otherwise in the LOS and the Scout handbook has them lowercase, but I have always disagreed with it. On the other hand, I do agree with Ed that we need to be consistent throught the Scouting articles. Rlevse 21:42, 17 March 2006 (UTC)

Rlevse echoes my views on caps in regards titles. As to consistency, you're not going to get an argument from me. I fully supported the proposed layouts that Ed proposed and have been trying to be sure we have some good articles. I've lost count of the number of scouting related articles I've had to fix things along those lines, as I'm sure the rest of us have. --Emb021 22:03, 17 March 2006 (UTC)

BTW: We were both adding the same info (Brownsea etc.) to the Boy Scouts (Boy Scouts of America) article at the same time. When I tried to save, I got the edit conflict message and simply pasted my edits back in until I could see what had been added. Weird how that happened.

Annoying is what I would say. I've been burned 2-3 times because of that, loosing stuff I wrote and had to re-create it.

FWIW, I've been in Scouting since 1969 and Venturing since 1999. Doc Miller's office is about 10 minutes from here: he was my Wood Badge counselor. Seems like we have a lot of the same interests. I've seen your web site, and indeed have referenced it several times, before I knew that was you. It does have a bit of a bandwith cap, so I can only get so many looks before it closes. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 21:18, 17 March 2006 (UTC)

Lucky. Very early 70s was when I joined Cub Scouts. I was involved in Exploring before the split, and automatically moved over and was aware, thru on-line sources, about the change. Doc Miller was always this mythical figure I heard of. Never got to met him until this past January at Sea Base. Being a local nobody, I don't get to move in those circles. Yeah, I hate the bandwith cap, but its free. --Emb021 22:03, 17 March 2006 (UTC)

This media may be deleted.

Thanks for uploading Image:Mr-36f.gif. I notice the 'image' page currently doesn't specify who created the content, so the copyright status is unclear. If you have not created this media yourself then there needs to be an argument why we have the right to use the media on Wikipedia (see copyright tagging below). If you have not created the media yourself then it needs to be specified where it was found, i.e., in most cases link to the website where it was taken from, and the terms of use for content from that page.

If the media also doesn't have a copyright tag then one should be added. If you created/took the picture, audio, or video then the {{

for the full list of copyright tags that you can use.

If you have uploaded other media, consider checking that you have specified their source and copyright tagged them, too. You can find a list of 'image' pages you have edited by clicking on the "

) 22:40, 22 March 2006 (UTC)

Checked the article I placed this in and the image is now redundant. Delete it. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 12:58, 25 March 2006 (UTC)

Ed: Pls update me on the rank issues. I'm getting confused on all the changes. If done, delete items from Todo page "current issues". Except for Eagle, where did they end up and in what form? YIS, Randy Rlevse 23:18, 26 March 2006 (UTC)

Done. They were merged into

02:36, 27 March 2006 (UTC)

Ah. Nice job. I agree to leave our requirements as they change often. Rlevse 11:03, 27 March 2006 (UTC)

Thanks. Actually, I think it would be a good policy to not include complete lists of requirements, but a reference. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 14:31, 27 March 2006 (UTC)

Sorry, yes there were some crossed wires. I thought it best to stick just with "Gulf War", which is better understood in common parlance than "Persian Gulf War".--Ahwaz 17:40, 28 March 2006 (UTC)

Agreed. I'm not particulary fond of the term, but is the accepted one. I prefer Liberation of Kuwait myself. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 17:56, 28 March 2006 (UTC)

I was just over at our Scout center: they still have a quantity of assistant Scoutmaster Varsity and Venture crew chief emblems for sale. Let me know if you want one. --Gadget850 ( Ed)

The full name is "Persian Gulf War", "Gulf War" is simply the shortened version of the full name "Persian Gulf War" used in common situations, but still the full encyclopedic title is "Persian Gulf War" as used by other authoritative encyclopedias. Please restore the original version. --

21:49, 28 March 2006 (UTC)

Why? Very little of the war took place in the body of water known as the Persian Gulf. And why me? Gulf War was developed by consensus long before I became a Wikipedia editor. I've simply defended the useage of a term developed by consensus (and one that I personally don't care for). This is the ENGLISH Wikipedia, and Gulf War was the term in use by English speaking contries at the time. Focus on the article, not the terms. What encyclopedias are you referring to? --Gadget850 ( Ed)

I'm not aware of this "consensus" you are speaking about. Regardless, such consensuses are not arbitrary and the the full encyclopedic title should be "Persian Gulf War" as indicated by Encyclopedia Britannica [2] , Encyclopedia Encarta [3], Encyclopedia.com [4], The Columbia Encyclopedia [5] and every other major Encyclopedia out there. --

ManiF

16:54, 29 March 2006 (UTC)

Then take it up on the talk page. If you really feel this stongly about it, you should be making a proposal to move the article to

Liberation of Kuwait. I am not the only editor to defend against these name changes. --Gadget850 ( Ed)

17:18, 29 March 2006 (UTC)

deletions

Ed, when you have something not used anymore, like an empty cat, I've found you get about a one day turnaround if you use Deletebecause instead of the other method. Randy, Rlevse 17:51, 30 March 2006 (UTC)

Thanks. It appears you like the archive thing. Took me a bit to figure it out. --Gadget850 ( Ed)

==Welcome to

) 17:21, 3 April 2006 (UTC)

Thanks!

---

A Download Is Now Available

I just wanted to let you know that a download of

) 09:49, 9 April 2006 (UTC)

Thank you

Thanks for the tips on the pages/deletions Ed from William

Thanks for adding a signature, I'm still learning how to do all that.

User:The Frog

Ed: Where is that list of tools you once showed me? I can't find them now. Randy, Rlevse 14:29, 15 April 2006 (UTC)

From my user page just click on Wikipedia links at the top. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 16:20, 15 April 2006 (UTC)

Tks. I've linked to it from my toolbox page. See my new user, talk, etc pages. I stole the idea from Naha. It really helps organize your stuff. Check out About me for all the places I've been too. Rlevse 21:53, 15 April 2006 (UTC)

Happy Easter to all of you, and I hope that this version may fix your current problems and perhaps provide you with a few useful new tools. You can download version 1.1 at

) 06:45, 16 April 2006 (UTC)

Ed: I was never happy with the manual way to revert those scumbag vandals and only thought admins/vandal patrollers could revert using a program (not sure why I thought that). Then I saw you used VandalProof and registered for it and just installed the new version. I love it! I haven't rv'd any vandal yet using it, but so far I'm impressed. I added a bit on using the My Watchlist function (prob use it more than "recent changes") to the help page. Pls let me know of any tips you discover. Rlevse 12:18, 16 April 2006 (UTC)

If you are getting this, it is because you do or did work on Scouting articles (see Wikipedia:WikiProject_Scouting#Participants_and_primary_areas_of_interest).

As the Scouting WikiProject has been formed since early January 2006, we've had many great improvements made in this area of Wiki and I want to personally thank everyone for their help. We don't always agree on things, but we keep moving forward. YIS, Rlevse 22:09, 25 April 2006 (UTC) EXTRA KUDOS FOR YOU ED!

Page loading

A bunch of Wiki pages won't load right now, inlcuding the Eagle article. Do you know what's wrong?Rlevse 15:23, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

WP has been broken for a bit. I was just now able to pull up my talk page. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 17:16, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

The Keeler entry his my watchlist on the Eagle and DESA lists. Since I can easily verify DESA guys, I did. See the Eagle list talk page. Rlevse 20:57, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

Thanks! --Gadget850 ( Ed) 20:59, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

Do you know enough about him to write an article? Doesn't he live near you? He's the only one on our DESA list without an article. YIS, Randy, Rlevse 10:14, 25 May 2006 (UTC)

I've been thinking on that- I have enough to start a stub. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 11:43, 25 May 2006 (UTC)

OK: stub started. Woof! --Gadget850 ( Ed) 14:25, 25 May 2006 (UTC)

Ed: See this...Portal_talk:Scouting#Webelos. The guy was obviously trying to be helpful. I'll support whateve you want to do with this stub. My suggestion would be to merge it into the main Cub article (if there's anything to merge) and afd the stub. Let me know. Rlevse 10:12, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

I saw it. I've been mulling it over. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 10:23, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

Ed and Wim: I'm going to list the Eagle Scout article for a formal peer review in a few moments in the hope in about 2 weeks to list it as a FAC. Based on my experience with other FACs and one of my own successful FAs, I think there are two things people may object to: a) is the lead long enough? and b) are there too many lists? Please think these issues over. Thanks for all the help, Randy. YIS, Rlevse 11:46, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

I just don't like the lead-in. The first paragraph needs work as well. I'll leave some comments on the talk page. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 12:13, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

Right now I think the article is almost ready for FAC. But there's one thing I know will get pinged: the lead in. While there is not set length, many reviewers will feel this one is too short. The requirement,

14:41, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

Large scale merging

Please try to avoid large scale merges w/o discussion. I have restored the BSA rank articles... --Cat out 19:27, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

Merge tags were placed on each article on 16 Mar 2006. No objections were made on any of the individual articles, thus the merge was made 7 days later on 23 Mar. Discussion did take place, specifically on the Scouting portal and at

20:22, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

Wow- you've been busy today! --Gadget850 ( Ed) 19:55, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

Not quite. My busy days have several hundered edits per day.

I created all of those articles merged. Since my creation they were somewhat expanded (I was couting on someones eagle project covering the topic).

The 7 day rule doesn't mean anything to me as I have thousands of articles on my watchlist. I think it wouldn't have hurt to inform me.

I feel the individual rank articles have a potential to expand given time each rank has a history after all (see eagle article). A merge is unnecesary.

--Cat out 20:39, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

The discussion you talk about is between two users, one being you. That is not exactly concensus... --Cat out 20:40, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

CC:Your one man reversion campaign is even less of a consensus and avails no one of any opportunity whatsoever if you'd watched the articles closer. Rlevse 20:47, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

Also at

Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Scouting/RulesStandards. Several of these talk pages have been archived now. I really wish you had joined up at the Scouting Portal and discussed this. From my point of view, it appears that you are accusing me of doing something without consensus or reason. And in turn, there is the appearance that you are doing a lot of reverts without consensus. You created those articles in Aug 2005 and have not touched them since. It appears that you only became aware of this when Rlevese alerted you to the change in the Eagle userbox. In the past few months, we have gotten a Project together and created standards. I can't answer for why you haven't been aware of this, but the reverts and edits of today aren't helpful. You obviously saw the merge tags when you reverted the articles since you then edited them out. I really don't know what to make of this, but it's neither friendly or courteous. Ah well, I have Scouting to do tonight- enough for today. --Gadget850 ( Ed)

21:06, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

• While you were gone...

The Scouting WikiProject started some months back. Everyone who had been active in editing Scouting articles at the time was invited to join, and Rlevese was selected as the co-ordinator. Since then, we have been on an active campaign to standardize and improve the Scouting articles. We feel that every article should have the potentiol to become a Good Article, and the best should be pushed to become Feature Articles. Early on, we worked on the seperate ranks, and I initially campaigned to keep them separate. The consensus that I eventually joined was to merge them. We looked at the rank articles and decided that as they were, they did not stand alone, except for Eagle Scout (and possibly Webelos- that's in discussion now). If you will look, you will see that we split the BSA article into

Boy Scouts (Boy Scouts of America)

, thus creating a separate article for the troop level program. Once we did this, the ranks fit neatly into that article. One of the decisions we made is to NOT list all the requirements for a rank or award, but let the reference do the work, with an overview. We still have a lot of work to do, but there is a logical framework in place. We have to remember that we are writing this for non-Scouts, or for Scouts from other programs. BSA Scouts aren't going to be using this as an in-depth reference.

I really feel that a merge notice for 7 days is quite reasonable. It's been well over two months since the merge tags were added, so I'm really not sure where you are going with that. There was quite a bit of discussion that is now rather scattered since pages were split and talk pages were archived. I also don't get the Eagle project reference: you were expecting a Scout to take this on? Even after 30 years at this, I've learned a lot of new things about the program in the last six months.

So- instead of jumping to a conclusion without checking to see how this is put together, how about a presumption of good faith? The folks in the Scouting WikiProject have been working as a team here, with people coming and going- all are welcome. The articles you created were a good start, and parts of them do remain, but they aren't YOUR articles, nor are they mine.

--Gadget850 ( Ed) 02:02, 7 June 2006 (UTC)

BTW: All of the images in the rank articles, such as Image:BSA Star Scout.gif were retagged around tha same time. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 13:29, 7 June 2006 (UTC)

I am sorry I caused stess on you guys... As inexcusable my action is, I apologise. Ok, let's talk about it as I feel both of us have calmed down from the unpleasant encounter we had. I will take the liberty on explaining my actions.

I believe every scount rank has the potential in growing into a complete article. If you take a look at the history section on

, you'll see the history of the insignia alone has enough information to prompt an individual article. Also, each rank insignia has a meaning of its own such as the loop visible on second class, first class, etc.

In my view merging all of the ranks into one article limits the potential and reduces them to being 'meanagless scout ranks'.

--Cat out 17:12, 7 June 2006 (UTC)

I offer my talk page as a single point for this discussion. Rlevse 17:24, 7 June 2006 (UTC)

From another old Pershing guy. Bravo Battery, 1/81st FA 1983/85. Dipics 14:55, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

I'm not sure of the purpose of this infobox, but you might want to switch the image to "Scoutsgreengoldnoscroll.png". --Gadget850 ( Ed) 13:46, 29 June 2006 (UTC)

Done, Ed, and what I intend to do (though it doesn't yet look right) can be seen at

Afghan Scout Association. Chris

01:57, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

Interesting. Infoboxes don't work for everything, but I'm curious to see how it goes. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 02:00, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

The

05:55, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

Hi Ed, as an active member of the Scouting wikiproject, would you care to respond to the wikipedia:Featured article candidates/Baden-Powell House. Any comment, either supportive or suggestions for improvement and similar feedback will be appreciated. Wim van Dorst (Talk) 16:10, 1 July 2006 (UTC).

There is some discussion of the appropriateness for a Venturing crew to choose the khaki shirts (as is commonly done in our neck of the woods) on the Uniform talk page. I still haven't had a chance to ask knowledgeable scouters about the "official" policy on this. Hopefully, I will have a chance in the next couple weeks. Good idea to keep the {{citation}}: Empty citation (help) in the articles. --NThurston 17:32, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

I put up the Eagle article for the main page on 21 Aug (94th anniv of Eldred's BOR). The write up at: Wikipedia:Today's_featured_article/requests#Eagle_Scout_.28Boy_Scouts_of_America.29 needs to be what is shown on the main page, if it makes it there. I you would like a chance to wordsmith it. Rlevse 12:29, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

I know you're working on the Eldred article, but one of the last few edits leaves a gigantic white spaced (most of a screen, on IE at least) and only two lines of intro. Pls check it out. Rlevse 14:51, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

Already fixed. I didn't close the ref tag properly, so the following text got stuck in the reference section. --Gadget850 ( Ed)

na. problem still there, there's a footnote alone in upper left corner and Eldred's pic has no text beside it at all and the lead is still only two lines long. I just looked. Send an email to [email protected] and I'll send a screenshot. I can't recall your email. Rlevse 15:04, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

Now the display is ok, but the lead is only 2 lines long. I think it should be nearer to the length it was before. Rlevse 15:14, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

Looks like you can't put cites into image captions. Not a big problem, as the images really don't need a ref. The lead is two lines at the moment- it does need work, but I thought some of the stuff didn't belong in the lead. I'm going to add some comments in the text so I can remember where I was. I'm feeling rather crappy at the moment and might just go home early (this miight also explain a few dumb mistakes I made in editing. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 15:17, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

Do you know why the comparing of verisions button doesn't appear on any article for the last hour or so? Seems a system wide wiki problem. Rlevse 15:08, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

Eldred's medal is Bronze Honor Medal, which is what the system was back then from what I understand and that's what his refs refer to it as. Nice work today.Rlevse 18:50, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

I think this is probably as good as it gets. It's a bit shorter than it was, but I chopped out the section on the formation of Troop 1, as it's really not releveant.

You know what's weird: I'm re-reading Stephen King's Dark Tower series. Two recurring elements are Arthur Eld (a sort of King Arthur figure) and a red rose (sort of a Holy Grail analog). --Gadget850 ( Ed) 19:15, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

Could you post the information about where the grave is located? --evrik 22:46, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

• Found it buried in the photo section! --Gadget850 ( Ed) 00:56, 11 July 2006 (UTC)
  • I just copied that comment to the talk page. --evrik 03:04, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

I've added us at

14:18, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

January? It was nominated on 18 June and made FA on 23 June. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 14:25, 14 July 2006 (UTC) OOPS, mine was Jan. I'll fix.Rlevse 14:48, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

Kinda figured that :-) --Gadget850 ( Ed)

How's that for paraphrasing from the Commissioner Fieldbook for Unit Service :-) ? CQJ 21:54, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

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Not to say a separate article titled

would not be interesting. I'm sure a lot of interesting facts and views would come up.

Are you going to link BSA and Boy Scouts (BSA) to the history article? Rlevse 13:51, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

Yes: see the series box I just added to the BSA article. --Gadget850 ( Ed)

Aha, I like the box and that it's to the right of the TOC, it may be good to do that for all the articles in the box. Nice work. Rlevse 13:57, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

I'm going to make this a template. What else do we want in the series box?

The basic programs are there. Perhaps Eagle Scout, esp since it's an FA. I'm not sure about putting Exploring in, I think if it's linked from one of the articles in the template, that'd be okay.Rlevse 14:35, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

User:NThurston did a lot of cool updates to the template. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 16:15, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

We should probably add a few more articles to the infobox template, especially those that are exclusively BSA-oriented. Let me know what ideas you have. --NThurston 16:34, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

If you don't want to put in the Eagle Scout article, how about Advancement and recognition in the Boy Scouts of America? It's at least as important, if not more so, than history. Rlevse 16:47, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

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I know you use the maintained tag some. Just a friendly suggestion that you may want to put it on the Boy Scouts of America, Boy Scouts (BSA), and History of... articles. I made a list of the ones I've put it on at User:Rlevse/maintained so I can track them. I collect MBs (have over 1100 of them), that's why 3 of them are MB articles-;) Rlevse 01:20, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

Not a problem, my good Scouting buddy, you more than deserve it. BTW, when you are ready to put the two BSA articles up for FA, let me know. The history has potential too, but I think it's a tad behind the other two.Rlevse 11:42, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

Sure. Life has been busy lately, so I've been sluoghing off here a bit. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 12:34, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

I did a lot on Gilwell Park today. I've having a very rough time finding a good photo for it, especially free of copyrights. Do you know of some? If you have input on the article, let me know. It was a stub, now start class, not far from B-class. Rlevse 18:01, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

I finally found some on flickr and they're all public. But if you come across better ones, let me know.Rlevse 11:48, 2 August 2006 (UTC)

Well, they're not public after all, but I did contact the person who took them.Rlevse 13:53, 2 August 2006 (UTC)

I don't have anything. I know someone who did go to Gilwell sometime ago, but I seem to recall that it was a rainy day and nothing was going on. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 15:27, 2 August 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for your recent work at their related articles. They are my favourite band, but I am not working much on them becouse I am mostly an "advanced expert" of Pink Floyd. Should anyone be willing to plan to delete articles such as the Tangerine Tree, please contact me immediately, becouse I have found a remarkable example that shows that artists are not always against (any kind of) bootlegs.--Doktor Who 19:19, 2 August 2006 (UTC)

As noted in the article, TD has sanctioned the TT releases on a non-profit basis, so I think there should not ba any issues. I do welcome your input on the look and feel of the article. I know it's not as visual as the PF articles, but the sheer number of graphics would be overwhelming. I think I'm going to include sample images for each era. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 20:27, 2 August 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the headsup about the article. Unfortunately, the text reads like marketing copy and is verbatim from Wilson's own website — not a single word changed. I've posted a copyvio banner. It's not likely I'll get a chance to re-read or research the book anytime soon, so you might want to take a crack at a new article. Canonblack 11:59, 3 August 2006 (UTC)

Ah- I really hadn't read the article as yet. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 12:02, 3 August 2006 (UTC) BTW- All you really have to do on a copyvio is cut the offending text. If no one fixes it in the next week or so, the article gets deleted. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 12:54, 3 August 2006 (UTC)

The CSD tag was a troll. Tyrenius 20:47, 8 August 2006 (UTC)

I figured as much, but gotta go with the flow. Looks like User:63.23.13.114 has been busy today. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 21:03, 8 August 2006 (UTC)

Thought you may be interested in this article, noticed you hadn't edited it.Rlevse 03:24, 12 August 2006 (UTC)

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See recent multiple changes by a anon on the BSA article. I reverted one highly POV edit and am debating about the others he made. Rlevse 09:56, 31 August 2006 (UTC)

Same anon is at it again.Rlevse 18:57, 31 August 2006 (UTC)

Have you changed where you want to put the gold eagle or are just seeing how it looks now? Rlevse 13:37, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

Hmmm... I thought we had discussed this, but it look like there was no real consensus. Lets put the eagle first and see what happens. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 13:42, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

A/B has them first, starting with C you put them after, that's why I asked. Rlevse 13:43, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

PS: I've noticed some names have nothing after them, some a semicolon, some a comma, we should make them consistent. I think this has featured list potential, which I think you mentioned before. Rlevse 13:46, 4 September 2006 (UTC); PPS, I vote for ;. Rlevse 13:47, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

I just noticed that as well. Semicolon works for me. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 13:48, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

Did we miss getting a cite on Bailey? --Gadget850 ( Ed) 13:56, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

HM. I recall seeing web refs on him, must have forgotten to put them in. Rlevse 13:59, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

Image size: try 22px (see A listing), I think it's better than 20 and anything else is too big. Rlevse 13:59, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

OK- I'd rather change the size of the image than have to mess with adding a size tag on everything. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 14:03, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

Done- I changed the image to 22 px (after uploading the original size image by mistake) --Gadget850 ( Ed) 14:06, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

Periods...some narratives(text) have periods at the end and some don't...? Rlevse 14:11, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

Use period. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 14:17, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

Spaces...suggest single space btwn gold image and name link.Rlevse 14:13, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

OK --Gadget850 ( Ed) 14:17, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

OK- A-E looks good. How about you take F down and I go from Z up and meet in the middle. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 14:23, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

Formatting:

1. Gold Eagle image if DESA, space
2. name
3. space (deceased) if dead
4. semicolon;
5. Description sentence: First letter cap, end with period. Wikify, but don't repeat previous links.

Thumbnails: add one or more thumbnails of the more prominent Eagles in the section. Don't over-run the section.

I've finished the big run through the article. I see 3 things left 1) make sure the gold DESA tags are on the right people, 2) you finish the stuff you were doing when you put the "cleanup" entry in the edit summarries, and 3) put mission numbers on all the astronauts (some have this, some don't, they should be consistent and I'll take this one). Rlevse 21:09, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

Thats about it- I take 2. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 21:27, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

Completed item 1, when you're done with item 2, we should take a serious look at FL listing.Rlevse 11:45, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

re Robert O. Bailey, this was an anon listing on 31 July. The anon put his troop, city, and year of eagle in the summary. On the web, can only find he is indeed a wildlife artist, but no Eagle confirmation. What do you want to do? Rlevse 15:13, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

Leave it tagged for a while, then delete it if there is no cite. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 15:15, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

John Smith is also missing a cite. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 15:16, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

Made your suggested changes to the lead. Many thanks, good catch. Do you think it looks better with or without the infobox? Let me know if you have more ideas on it, or just edit it yourself. Rlevse 13:49, 6 September 2006 (UTC)

Will do. I've found a few grammar and spelling issues that I'm fixing. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 13:54, 6 September 2006 (UTC)

thanks for the support and help! Rlevse 15:41, 6 September 2006 (UTC), Randy

Something amiss with Ashton, he was born in 1915 but got Eagle in 1963...three possibilities: I typed eagle year wrong, he is one of the last adults that got it, or there are two ashtons....Rlevse 14:59, 6 September 2006 (UTC)

It says he got it as a youth, circa 1930, so I'll check my master original when I get home.Rlevse 15:04, 6 September 2006 (UTC)

OK- I got that link from the article, so 2 out of 3 Ashtons are the same. --Gadget850 ( Ed)

THe orginal BSA list says 1963 indeed and if the bio is correct that he got it as a youth, there are two Marvin J. Ashton's out there that are Eagle Scouts. Rlevse 20:18, 6 September 2006 (UTC)

References are supposed to be for major sources of information in the article: see Wikipedia:Citing sources#Complete citations in a "References" section. PLEASE STOP.

The articles you are adding this document to already have individuals in the category of "Eagle Scouts." If you really MUST provide a link to this document, do it as a link i in the article, like this: [6], or a footnote if the article has footnotes rather than embedded links. John Broughton 17:20, 6 September 2006 (UTC)

Please don't SHOUT. If you would note, I added the Eagle Scout category at the same time as the reference. I just read the reference you noted, but I don't see the problem. As best I see, the example you are giving is an embedded link, but you are telling me to not use an embedded link. I'm afraid I don't get it.

If you have an issue with a particular article, then please let me know. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 17:32, 6 September 2006 (UTC)

So, It appears that you believe that Dana Rohrabacher is not an Eagle Scout, as you reverted the reference and the category? --Gadget850 ( Ed) 17:37, 6 September 2006 (UTC)

Apologies, I missed the fact that you had added categories; I've added them back. I don't dispute in any way that Rohrabacher is an Eagle Scout.

Embedded links are fine. A footnote is fine. Which you should use depends on how an article is set up; either requires some text in the body of the article, saying that "X was an Eagle Scout" (or similar). But setting up a separate section called "References", as you did with Dana Rohrabacher, and then adding a line with the description of the document and the link to it, is NOT fine. A separate "References" section as you created it in the article is supposed to be used for (essentially) bibliographic/widespread sources that support the entire article.

If the above still doesn't make sense, why don't you see if you can find some text in one or both of the cited policies that seems to support what you did, and cite that here? John Broughton 21:18, 6 September 2006 (UTC)

I have no interest in any more edits to Rohrabacher. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 23:13, 6 September 2006 (UTC)

Saw Clive Cussler, you might also take a look at Fred Phelps. Chris 20:01, 14 September 2006 (UTC)

I'm afraid that Phelps is an Eagle Scout. See his bio at :godhatesfags.com --Gadget850 ( Ed) 20:33, 14 September 2006 (UTC)

Also I have seen claims of 12 year old Eagle Scouts, notably a Supreme Court justice and the University of Texas shooter, both from the age when there were time requirements on the award. I'm going to see what I can get on Cussler, I bet he is. Chris 20:48, 14 September 2006 (UTC)

I know for a fact there have been 12-yr Eagles. I personally know two of them. This is more common after they lowered the age to join from 11 to 10 1/2. Rlevse 21:41, 14 September 2006 (UTC)

From Ask Andy:

Here is a timeline for the fast route to Eagle:

• Cross over at 10 years, 6 months - Scout rank
• Receive Tenderfoot, Second and First Class at 10 years, 7 months (30 days for physical fitness requirement and 10 quick outings)
• Star at 10 years, 11 months
• Life at 11 years, 5 months
• Eagle at 11 years, 11 months

--Gadget850 ( Ed) 01:47, 15 September 2006 (UTC)

All doable in an active troop with a motivated kid. I'm told the BSA record is 12y 6mos. Rlevse 02:02, 15 September 2006 (UTC)

Though I haven't found something that directly says so, I'm convinced Trost and Cech are DESAs and Eagles. The names are not common and the Eagle year is in the right time frame from birth year. What do you think? Rlevse 15:06, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

I've been pondering Trost for a while. I think you are right on these two. I also believe Jay L. Johnson, since the DESA list specifically says "admiral". --Gadget850 ( Ed) 15:34, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

see Johnson update I found. Rlevse 17:13, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

I added Trost, he is the right age, unusual name, and keeps showing up at big BSA shindigs. I still think Cech is a DESA too, but will wait a bit. Rlevse 18:18, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

Made DESA list a redir (see if anyone balks), put Ceck on talk page list as needing verifying. We should look over the list, made articles for red links if possible, and submit to FLC. Rlevse 19:17, 26 September 2006 (UTC)

I saw that- looks good. I started a stub on User:Gadget850/Jere Ratcliffe. I'd like to get it a bit more complete before moving it into the articlespace. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 19:43, 26 September 2006 (UTC) And its already the top hit on Google.

I wrote the article on Bass to get rid of the red link. Actually an interesting story. Then two MILHIST project buddies helped fix it up. It's in OK shape now and I nom'd it for DYK as he got two Navy Crosses in less than two months. I have a request out to use a photo too.Rlevse 02:31, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

c I started on User:Gadget850/Edgar Cunningham. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 19:18, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

• Found his grandaughter's email. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 20:12, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

I emailed his grandaughter, Carla McDonald and asked for more information to round this out. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 12:35, 29 September 2006 (UTC)

Cool. Rlevse 12:45, 29 September 2006 (UTC)

I got a bit of info from her today. Added birth and death dates and marriage info. What do you think- ready to move into article space as a stub? --Gadget850 ( Ed) 00:52, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

Yep, it has more than a lot of stubs. Just add to it if they give more or you find more. I'm still waiting on info from Eldred's son (he said he'd send some) to add to Arthur's article. The son is in his 70s now. Rlevse 02:21, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

Done

1) I think there's a typo...married in 1921 (at age 11)?

It was 1931- thanks.

2) If troop formed in 1925 (was in another troop first) and he made Eagle in 1926, it only took him a year? Was this possible back then? Rlevse 09:48, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

Eagle was still part of the merit badge system, and the only requirements in 1926 were to earn 21 merit badges, with 11 required. So, I would say it was possible. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 11:43, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

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A non-project member created these. I think they should be merged, but where? Rlevse 10:05, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

I comment on the article talk pages. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 11:11, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

• I agree on the first, but I think the second could be expanded and made noteworthy. --evrik 13:52, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

I'm responding on the talk page. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 13:54, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

See email I just sent. Rlevse 15:41, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for uploading

).

If you have uploaded other unlicensed media, please check whether they're used in any articles or not. You can find a list of 'image' pages you have edited by clicking on the "my contributions" link (it is located at the very top of any Wikipedia page when you are logged in), and then selecting "Image" from the dropdown box. Note that any fair use images not used in any articles will be deleted after seven days, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. Thank you. Gay Cdn (talk) (Contr.) 21:49, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

Orphaned fair use image (Image:BSA president.JPG)

Thanks for uploading

our fair use policy

).

If you have uploaded other unlicensed media, please check whether they're used in any articles or not. You can find a list of 'image' pages you have edited by clicking on the "my contributions" link (it is located at the very top of any Wikipedia page when you are logged in), and then selecting "Image" from the dropdown box. Note that any fair use images not used in any articles will be deleted after seven days, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. Thank you. Gay Cdn (talk) (Contr.) 21:49, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

GSUSA

Ed, Girl Scouts of the USA needs copyedit on the second para of the Segregation section. I tried, but i'm getting stumped. A reviewer (legitimately) said it was a random collection of facts. Can you give this, and if you desire, the whole article a shot? Thanks. Rlevse 02:32, 3 November 2006 (UTC)

I just got back from Indiana. I will take a look when my brain is a bit more rested. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 04:28, 3 November 2006 (UTC)

Vandals

Do you still use VP? A lot of people are getting fed up with the unfixed bugs, lack of response to problems, etc. This includes me. I want to keep using it but can get logged in anymore. A new version was promised 6 months ago but never showed up. It's frustrating because I really like VP's tracking and reporting capabilities. What do you use/recommend? Rlevse 18:39, 4 November 2006 (UTC)

I switch between several PCs and stopped using it. I usually do revert with pop-ups. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 18:46, 4 November 2006 (UTC)

• How do you do a revert with a popup?Rlevse 19:12, 4 November 2006 (UTC)

First enable popus as noted in Wikipedia:Tools/Navigation popups. When you have an article to revert, bring up the history page. Find the date and time you want to revert back to and hover on it. The popup menu will show- move to actions and click revert. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 19:27, 4 November 2006 (UTC)

Eagle Scout

Eagle Scout BSA will be on Main Page on 14 Nov! Yeah! I nominated it back in the summer and had almost given up hope he'd ever pick it. Gilwell Park is nom'd too. Rlevse 00:50, 7 November 2006 (UTC)

Sweet! --Gadget850 ( Ed) 01:57, 7 November 2006 (UTC)

Image

See image on James Brady. I made a new image, it doesn't look as scrunched as the other one. I'll convert if you want. Let me know....Lv msg on talk page, can't read email in daytime. Rlevse 14:53, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

I decided to be bold. I see you joined it. I'll work on refs more now. Rlevse 15:24, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

It is a bit wider and more defined. If you let me know what you want, I just copy the text into an editor and do a search and replace, making the update in one swoop.

List of Telecaster players is also up for FL- I like the layout. It uses fewer graphics, but they are used to better advantage instead of just filling in the spaces. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 15:28, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

We used DESA list as a ref too often, want do you want to do? Rlevse 15:39, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

It blew up! Let me think on this. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 15:41, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

Use it only when there's no other ref for a DESA? Rlevse 15:46, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

OK-I split the references- I will mark it on the talk page. Let me know how this works. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 16:16, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

Look at the second footnote on Trost. Appears to only mention Agre but shows by Trost????? Rlevse 15:05, 9 November 2006 (UTC)

Ooops. I copied the Agre ref into the DESA list ref. Agre actually had five extra refs. Thanks for catching that. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 15:23, 9 November 2006 (UTC)

Spoken files

See User_talk:Storkk#Scouts. Rlevse 12:28, 11 November 2006 (UTC)

I saw that- haven't had a change to check it out yet. But, I FOUND a cite for Fluckey! Woot- that was a lot of searching. Check it out- its interesting. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 12:53, 11 November 2006 (UTC)

Hmm, so he was an adult Eagle and got it after the war.Rlevse 13:09, 11 November 2006 (UTC)

Yes. The lead-in needs a bit of tweaking, as he was notable before he earned Eagle. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 13:13, 11 November 2006 (UTC)

Webelos

Okay. Sorry about that, didn't know that article existed. --Out-of-focus 05:21, 14 November 2006 (UTC)

No problem. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 11:49, 14 November 2006 (UTC)

San Francisco

Please don't patronize the editors at

San Francisco, California. It has been a constant struggle today to prevent to page from reading HOME TO COCKSUCKING FAGGOTS WORLDWIDE. Please look at the page history. All rules are meant to be broken. Please take the time to learn the circumstances before criticizing.--DaveOinSF

19:15, 17 November 2006 (UTC)

I had no intent of patronizing. I changed my comments to note that those were suggestions- do as you wish. Unless you have a team that is prepared to monitor the page for the 24 hours the article is up, there is no way you are going to keep up with the vandals. When Eagle Scout was up the other day, we got 294 edits over the 24 hours. After a few reverts, I realized that there was no way to keep up. I also realized that for every vandal, there was some other editor making a revert. I realize that you want to fight the good fight and keep your work intact. How about this- do as you will for now. After the article goes off the main page, think about it and let me know your thoughts at that point. I welcome constructive criticism, and I am going to allow that you are probably very irritated at this point. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 19:41, 17 November 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for your blessing to do as I will for now. That is certainly not patronizing, so siree. I will wholeheartedly reflect on this over the next few weeks. But for you to come in and complain to the people who were struggling with the HOME TO DICKSUCKING FAGGOTS WORLDWIDE vandals is not helpful. Please reflect on how you can better actually help the situation rather than criticize the effort being made without actually assisting, or even evaluating the actual facts on the ground.

I suppose it may be in the best interests of Wikipedia for readers to click on today's featured article and instead read HOME TO DICKSUCKING FAGGOTS WORLDWIDE, which is how the article appeared 20% of the time or more, but I don't really know how. So once again, thank you for whatever it is you think you contributed to the situation, and I will contact you again next week once we have BOTH had a chance to reflect.--DaveOinSF 19:54, 17 November 2006 (UTC)

Given your attitude, at this point I do not want any more dialog with you. Good day. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 19:59, 17 November 2006 (UTC)

Boy Scouts (Boy Scouts of America)

Ed, - I'm not sure if this is the right place to put this or not.. Can't see how to message you directly on here, but you keep editting out my comments on the BSA page "It's important to note that the Boy Scouts of America using the clause "morally straight" discriminate against homosexuals and bar them from their organization."

If a researcher comes to the boy scouts page and searches for "discrimination" or the word "homosexuals". No where on the page does it match. There is a link at the bottom of the page for "Boy Scouts of America membership controversies." But again, someone just searching on the main page on this would not match on the words "discrimation" or "homosexuals".

The Boy Scouts are known for their immoral discrimation policies and it should be noted somewhere on the main page for this organiation. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.236.208.25 (talk • contribs)

OK- first, just a bit of housekeeping:

1. New topics go at the bottom of a page. If you look at the "Edit this page" at the top, there is a + sign that automatically adds a new topic on the talk page.
2. Please sign your edits. See
   Wikipedia:Sign your posts on talk pages
   .
3. Please consider creating an account. If you edited the article with IP 70.174.162.210, it doesn't match the IP of 64.236.208.25 you used to add this topic. This makes it difficult to keep track of discussions. See Wikipedia:Why create an account?
4. Normally, you can reply back on your talk page, as I automatically watch my edits and will see your replies. This won't work if you use multiple IPs.

Thanks for stopping by to discuss this. Lets look at a few things:

1. Step back and look at the big picture: The first place someone would probably go is to the main article at Boy Scouts of America. This has a section titled "Membership Controversy" that is a summary of the main article at Boy Scouts of America membership controversies. That summary has been accepted by editors on both sides of the issue. It is in the 'main BSA article in an appropriate place.
2. The sub-articles (I think there are nine at the moment) all have a link to the controversy article. If the controversy stuff gets added to each each article, there are going to be nine variations according to the interest of the editors.
3. The statment you added does not have a citation. You have to be able to back up any entry, especially on a controversial statement like this. Please look at the controversy article and you will see that the issue in question is well documented and well cited. See Wikipedia:Citing sources.
4. You used the phrase "It's important to note"- in my opinion, this is a
   Wikipedia:Avoid weasel words
   .
5. Without any cites, your statement appears to present your opinion. See Wikipedia:Neutral point of view. Every editor has a POV, but we must work around that in order to write good articles.

I'm going to guess that you are new around here. That is great, but may I suggest you take a stab at other articles before you hit the controversies. This may be something near and dear to your heart, but that is another reason to step back and take a look at things. There are lots of articles to get involved in.

I know I've thrown a lot at you in one gulp. I've been editing here about a year, and I've had a lot of this thrown at me a bit at a time. I don't know all the answers, but I know who to ask here. And thats is part of the Wikipedia community- forming relationships.

You are starting off the right way by resonding to my message and discussing this. Communicating is a highly regarded skill here. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 16:55, 14 November 2006 (UTC)

Award

Thanks! --Gadget850 ( Ed) 15:14, 19 November 2006 (UTC)

The Military history WikiProject Newsletter: Issue IX - November 2006

The

November 2006 issue

of the Military history WikiProject newsletter has been published. You may read the newsletter, change the format in which future issues will be delivered to you, or unsubscribe from this notification by following the link. Thank you.

This is an automated delivery by grafikbot 22:26, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

Scouting positions

Ed- Thanks for the welcome to Scouting Wikiproject. I had started by expanding the section of youth leadership positions in boy scout troops, and was thinking that maybe there should be an article somewhere talking about all of BSA's youth leadership positons (Sea Scouting, Varsity, Boy Scouts ect). I wasn't sure if this already exsisted somewhere, or was tried and deleted or something, but wanted to check with someone before I created it. Thanks,

eric

00:29, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

I'm not sure that we would want to split things up that way. Right now we have the uniforms as one article because of the overlap of the tan/green uniform and the common insignia. There really is not much comparison between say a denner and a patrol leader. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 00:57, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

Scouting

I took a shot at cleaning up the section on sections. Thoughts? Rlevse 20:03, 4 December 2006 (UTC)

I got this answer

It look like

List of Eagle Scouts (Boy Scouts of America), is going to be on the Featured Content page. Where is the page that list what is on there when in the future, akin to the FA main page nominations page? Rlevse

22:45, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

Hi. The Featured content page doesn't work like the Main page. Rather than having one article/picture/list per day it shows randomly selected items each time the page is refreshed. If your browser is set up to reload on every page view then you should see different content every time you visit/refresh the page. Otherwise, there is a 'purge' link in the description at the top which will force a refresh. Since there isn't a fixed schedule there is no page corresponding to the 'article of the day nominations/coordination page'... just a randomly selected list at Wikipedia:Featured content/Lists. Eventually all of the featured lists will be include in the choices for selection, but it takes a little time to set each of them up and we haven't completed the process yet. --CBD 08:31, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

Rlevse 10:48, 11 December 2006 (UTC)

Scouting and the Military

Hi Rlevse, question for you, I know that scouting is big in military communities. Particularly boy scouts, but I didn't come across anything in my research to support that claim. I was wondering if you had or knew of a source that tied scouting to the military? Balloonman 16:24, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

No, afraid I don't know of a source. It does seem big in areas with military bases as compared to other parts of the country. I'm dropping this question by User:Gadget850, he may know.Rlevse 16:44, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

My experience is 15 years out of date. During my Army career, I was a Scoutmaster five times. At Redstone Arsenal and Ft Hood the troop and pack were sponsored by MWR (Morale, Recreation and Welfare). In Germany we were sponsored by military units (an interesting story there). BSA units can no longer be sponsored by the military- I don't know haow that works today. I wouldn't say that there was any extra emphasis on Scouting in the US. In Germany, it was probably a bigger program, but youth opportunities over-all were probably more limited.

BTW- I added Jerri Manthey to the list of famous military brats. Her father was my first sergeant in the late 80's. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 17:22, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Now I have to ask you when were you in Germany? Since your experience is 15 years out of date, that would imply that you retired around the time my dad did.... and he was assigned to Patch Barracks in the mid 80s. Balloonman 20:38, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

I was in Neu-Ulm in 79-80 and 85-89. I took disability in 93. Doing Scouting in Germany was great. Skiing in Garmisch-Partenkirchen, Klondike Derby at Kandersteg International Scout Centre, the Berlin Historical Trail on both sides of the wall... --Gadget850 ( Ed) 20:47, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Stolen Valor Act of 2005

Thought you may be interested in this little article I wrote. I put it in for DYK, don't know if it'll make the main page, though. Rlevse 17:41, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

I knew of this, but did not know it had made it this far. OMSA is opposed to some of the provisions in this act as it seems to make collecting of certain medals illegal. I'm not an OMSA member, but they have an interesting site that I have used for information. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 20:31, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

I did not know of OMSA, but their inclusion is fair and balanced. It passed Congress overwhelmingly.Rlevse 20:35, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

I suspect it is going to take some legal wrangling to interpret this. Some of the OMSA guys are pretty serious collectors- most are veterans and one is a UN civilian (I found a bunch of copvios of his web site here a while back). --Gadget850 ( Ed) 20:40, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Unusual types of gramophone records

Would you still be up for uploading that scan of Poland? :' ) Tzaquiel 15:44, 21 December 2006 (UTC)

Sure. I need to fill in some other gaps in the TD discography images as well. I will probably work that this weekend. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 16:53, 21 December 2006 (UTC)

The Military history WikiProject Newsletter: Issue X - December 2006

The

December 2006 issue

of the Military history WikiProject newsletter has been published. You may read the newsletter, change the format in which future issues will be delivered to you, or unsubscribe from this notification by following the link. Thank you.

This is an automated delivery by grafikbot 22:41, 26 December 2006 (UTC)

Similar awards

Hi Ed. Good move on cutting the list in the Eagle Scout article and adding a details link to

List of highest awards in Scouting. I'd long thought that part was too listy but didn't know for sure what to do abou it.Rlevse

12:44, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

Thanks. I never did care for it in the article, but is notable. The numbers stuff is in three different places- I'm considering how to clean that up. --Gadget850 ( Ed) 13:45, 31 December 2006 (UTC)