Wikipedia:Featured list candidates/List of awards and nominations received by Community/archive1

The following is an archived discussion of a featured list nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured list candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The list was promoted by PresN via FACBot (talk) 00:26, 30 June 2020 (UTC) [1].[reply]

List of awards and nominations received by Community

List of awards and nominations received by Community (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)

• Featured list candidates/List of awards and nominations received by Community/archive1

Nominator(s): RunningTiger123 (talk) — Bilorv (talk) 05:50, 1 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

A cult favorite, Community is a meta-love letter to television and film, exploring and using tropes while also examining them. The show has had a huge and dedicated fandom since its release in 2009, but with its recent re-emergence on Netflix and some public cast get-togethers, it's gaining a fair bit more traction. The show was critically acclaimed but never huge in mainstream awards. I'm co-nominating this list with RunningTiger123, who has done most of the work on creating and expanding the list, which surprisingly didn't exist until April and has been long overdue for years. — Bilorv (talk) 05:50, 1 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Drive-by comment

• The format of awards/nominations lists consisting of lots of tiny tables has been deprecated for quite some time. Everything should be in one table (see e.g. List of awards and nominations received by Scarlett Johansson) -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 09:39, 1 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Pinging Bilorv to get his thoughts. The page was modeled after similar featured lists such as Black Mirror and Parks and Rec, but we can look into changing the format if that's the new standard. RunningTiger123 (talk) 20:10, 1 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    • Yeah, I'm rather confused given that the page you point to isn't an FL yet and there are at least dozens of current FLs with the multiple table format, the most recent one of which I contributed to being promoted in December 2018 (Black Mirror, linked above). If the multiple table format has been deprecated then could you point us to where this was established? — Bilorv (talk) 20:56, 1 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
      • I can't offhand point to exactly where it was established, but certainly all "awards and noms" FLs that I have seen promoted in the last year or so have been in the new format e.g. List of awards and nominations received by Kylie Minogue, List of awards and nominations received by Margaret, List of awards and nominations received by Dua Lipa, List of awards and nominations received by Emilia Clarke, List of awards and nominations received by Game of Thrones, List of awards and nominations received by Stranger Things, List of awards and nominations received by BTS, List of awards and nominations received by Exo, etc -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 21:29, 1 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
        • Curiouser and curiouser. I see a mention of the standard changing in Exo but again, no pointer to a discussion. Do you think you could suggest a venue where we could ask about this? My first two thoughts, Wikipedia talk:Featured list candidates and Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Awards, don't look very active. Presumably if the standard suddenly changed 12-18 months ago then there was a wide discussion about it. I think we're both happy to change the format if it's a requirement, but I'd like to see why the convention was changed and where. — Bilorv (talk) 07:50, 2 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
          • The best I have found so far is Wikipedia:Featured list candidates/List of awards and nominations received by Matthew McConaughey/archive1 (May 2018), where The Rambling Man said that the format of using lots of little tables (resulting in a massive TOC in some cases) did not look good and recommended changing to the format used by the then-existing FL List of accolades received by Call Me by Your Name, and pretty much every similar list since then has followed the same format............ -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 08:20, 2 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
            • Appreciate that your Black Mirror list was promoted after that - I don't remember noticing that one at the time....... -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 08:31, 2 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
              • I totally agree with Chris. Addition of heading for each award does nothing–except for adding extra bytes for the list. Seriously, why do I need to know this...., The Comedy Awards were presented by the television network Comedy Central for comedy in American television, film and other media. The first awards were given in 2011. I can just click on the article that is linked (if I wanted to know more)....... "The International Press Academy present the Satellite Awards in television, film, radio and other media" this is a piece of useless information. If you need help with merging tables I can assist you with that. Wikipedia:Wall of text is about long post to a noticeboard or talk page discussion but it applies here as well.~~ CAPTAIN MEDUSA^talk 18:01, 2 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
                • Alright, if RunningTiger123 is happy then let's run with this and change the format. I think the pair of us can handle the format change, but if you're interested in leaving a review CAPTAIN MEDUSA, perhaps once we've reshuffled everything, then that would be much appreciated. — Bilorv (talk) 19:01, 2 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
                  • I actually just finished a merged table in my sandbox. If it looks good, I can move it over. RunningTiger123 (talk) 19:03, 2 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
                    • Hi RunningTiger123, It looks good but I am not a big fan of small text (Derek R. Hill (production designer)). ~~ CAPTAIN MEDUSA^talk 19:13, 2 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
                      • I'm going to ping Bilorv on this again. While some articles don't use small text, others do, including featured lists (see Black Mirror and The Simpsons). I think the other articles use it to distinguish between nominees and extra information. If there has been a change to consensus, I'm more than happy to make the change, but I want to make sure the decision is consistent. RunningTiger123 (talk) 19:43, 2 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
                      • This falls under web accessibility. The small text is quite difficult to read. It's like a Text next to a Text. You have lean more closer to your monitor to read. ~~ CAPTAIN MEDUSA^talk 20:19, 2 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
                        • To be honest, I was wondering about this one. Still can't find clear instruction in
                          MOS:ACCESS but I think we should lean on the safe side and make the text normal-sized. — Bilorv (talk) 20:29, 2 June 2020 (UTC)[reply
                          ]
                        • Done. RunningTiger123 (talk) 16:55, 3 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
                    • Amazing, thanks for doing this. Go ahead and move it over, yeah. — Bilorv (talk) 19:35, 2 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comments on the lead

• No need to wikilink Yahoo! Screen twice
  • Done. RunningTiger123 (talk) 20:10, 1 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
• That's it :-) -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 19:08, 1 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comments on the table

• People's names should sort based on surname. Currently they sort on forename.
  • Yep, done. — Bilorv (Black Lives Matter) 12:53, 3 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
• That's it :-) -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 08:07, 3 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
• I made one little tweak to the notes which was easier to just do than to list here, and am now happy to support -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 15:29, 3 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• Support I can't find any reference problems --Guerillero | Parlez Moi 03:33, 14 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comments

• Add caption for the lead image

• Is a caption necessary for the image, or would it be redundant? I think the infobox is comparable to the one used in the FL List of awards and nominations received by Game of Thrones, which does not have a caption. RunningTiger123 (talk) 17:24, 14 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• Add a better ALT text

• Done. RunningTiger123 (talk) 17:24, 14 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• documentary spoofs → mockumentary?

• For now, I'm going to leave it as is because it more closely aligns with the linked articles' descriptions. RunningTiger123 (talk) 17:24, 14 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• gaining a cult following → more sources

• Done. RunningTiger123 (talk) 17:24, 14 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• Add sources at the end of a sentence. This makes it easier for the reader to find sources they are looking for rather than searching around.

• Done. RunningTiger123 (talk) 17:24, 14 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• What are the characters the actors play? Maybe introduce them in lead

• Instead of listing the characters individually, I added a link to the page List of Community characters. RunningTiger123 (talk) 17:24, 14 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• I've been thinking and reckon it's good to list the characters' common name in brackets after the actor—added for now but let me know if you disagree. — Bilorv (Black Lives Matter) 17:39, 14 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• Several episodes → link List of Community episodes

• I amended a sentence in the first paragraph to include the link to List of Community episodes. Let me know if this works. RunningTiger123 (talk) 17:24, 14 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• The third season → link
  Community (season 3)
• fourth season → link
  Community (season 4)
• fifth season → link
  Community (season 5)
• the sixth aired → link
  Community (season 6)

• Individual season links added. RunningTiger123 (talk) 17:24, 14 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• Archive sources

• I'm going to ping Bilorv on this one, since he did the archiving for most of the sources already. RunningTiger123 (talk) 17:24, 14 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• Rest should now be archived. — Bilorv (Black Lives Matter) 17:39, 14 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• Add a better short description

• Done. RunningTiger123 (talk) 17:24, 14 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• Add a better title to the list. Maybe 'Awards and nominations'

• For clarification, do you think this should be used or the full title like you have in the sronly template below? RunningTiger123 (talk) 17:24, 14 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• (Changed "List" to "Awards and nominations" for now.) — Bilorv (Black Lives Matter) 17:39, 14 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• Why do nominees(s) have a break? eg.

Steven Sprung and Peter B. Ellis

(for "A Fistful of Paintballs")

• This was modeled on the FL List of awards and nominations received by Parks and Recreation. Personally, I think it adds clarity by preventing text wrapping in the middle of the episode title, but I can change it if you think it would help. RunningTiger123 (talk) 17:24, 14 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• It flows better in the same line. See List of awards and nominations received by Scarlett Johansson for example. ~~ CAPTAIN MEDUSA^talk 11:16, 17 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• Done. RunningTiger123 (talk) 17:46, 17 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• |+ Awards and nominations received by Community → |+ Awards and nominations received by ''Community'' {{sronly|Awards and nominations received by ''Community''}}

• Done. RunningTiger123 (talk) 17:24, 14 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
• That's it from me. ~~ CAPTAIN MEDUSA^talk 11:43, 14 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support — Nice work! ~~ CAPTAIN MEDUSA^talk 14:02, 18 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
    • @CAPTAIN MEDUSA:: I know you already gave support, but I wanted to follow up on one point you made. You suggested changing the table title to use the {{sronly}} template, but that makes the title in plain text redundant. However, other featured lists seem to just use the title with no need for {{sronly}}. Do you think we should hide the title and use the template or just write out the title for the table so that it's visible? RunningTiger123 (talk) 16:29, 22 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
      • It helps people with a screen reader. ~~ CAPTAIN MEDUSA^talk 15:22, 23 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
        • So are both the plain text and the template needed, or just the template? RunningTiger123 (talk) 16:34, 23 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
          • My understanding is that {{sronly|text here}} appears exactly the same to a screen reader user as text here, but doesn't display at all to a visual reader—this is what
            sronly}} but not have the same text in plaintext, otherwise a screenreader user hears it read out twice in succession, and the sighted user still sees the redundant table title. — Bilorv (Black Lives Matter) 17:01, 23 June 2020 (UTC)[reply
            ]
          • @CAPTAIN MEDUSA: is this your understanding too? — Bilorv (Black Lives Matter) 13:56, 25 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]
            • @Bilorv and RunningTiger123: This might answer your question.

              Since FLC mandates that nominations follow ACCESS, this means that they'll need to start having captions. In the case that the table is the first thing in a section where the section header is essentially the same as what the caption would be, and therefore looks duplicative visually, you can make the caption screen reader-only with the template, e.g. "|+ {{sronly|Example table caption}}" instead of "|+ Example table caption".

              — PresN, Wikipedia talk:Featured list candidates#RFC that will effect us
              • Thanks, that's really helpful! RunningTiger123 (talk) 16:46, 25 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• Support The list is featured worthy. ~ HAL333 15:59, 26 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Source review passed; promoting. --PresN 03:50, 29 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

• Closing note: This
  WP:FLC/ar, and leave the {{featured list candidates}} template in place on the talk page until the bot
  goes through.