Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Singapore/2020 archive

This page is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.

Please see

Hi. An anonymous editor has added many stuff which may not be notable. Would it be possible for anyone to review the article 1995 in Singapore? Thanks. TheGreatSG'rean (talk) 05:19, 3 January 2020 (UTC)

Seems like Tide rolls had reverted the changes. The anon edits are clearly not required in the article. robertsky (talk) 02:44, 4 January 2020 (UTC)

Thanks for the prompt action. TheGreatSG'rean (talk) 18:19, 4 January 2020 (UTC)

Hi contributors, I would need help in two articles, namely, Straits Times Index and Penal Code (Singapore). For the first article, I need the graphs to be updated as the last revision to the graph was in 2012. As for Penal Code, it has to be amended to include new offences like voyeurism, protection for minors, etc. I would appreciate it if anyone is willing to help. Thanks. TheGreatSG'rean (talk) 05:43, 30 January 2020 (UTC)

Updated the chart for STI. Drop me an email if you want the data I had extracted from Yahoo. robertsky (talk) 07:32, 30 January 2020 (UTC)

Thanks for the update, really appreciate it. TheGreatSG'rean (talk) 17:20, 30 January 2020 (UTC)

Hi, an update to the

The one by CDC regions is updated. Totally red. rofl. robertsky (talk) 17:38, 20 February 2020 (UTC)

The one by planning area has no need for updates. the affected areas between 18 feb to 20 feb are already shaded due to previous cases. robertsky (talk) 17:42, 20 February 2020 (UTC)

Not really sure on whether to integrates ARIELE information to the ACMS wiki page. Ominae (talk) 11:13, 25 March 2020 (UTC)

For some reason, inexperienced Singapore editors have the tendency to copy and paste huge chunks of text from government or news websites into Wikipedia. I have already requested

Thanks, I have been working on SG BLP articles myself. Also, there is possible copyvio on Johor–Singapore Causeway, I haven't gotten around to complete the last part of the rewrite atUser:Robertsky/Drafts/Johor-Singapore Causeway. Probably will do so sometime this week, swap and request copyvio-del. robertsky (talk) 08:09, 7 April 2020 (UTC)

I've requested copyvio revdel on 8 (I think) articles so far. Even text on government agencies that are not copyvio are mostly promotional and unencyclopedic spam. While looking through the history to nominate revdel, I noticed many Singaporean editors editing the articles. I would urge editors to simply remove the promotional spam rather than trying to salvage an unsalvageable mess. An short, encyclopedic stub is better than a long article bloated with buzzwords, original research and blatant promotion. Darylgolden^(talk) Ping when replying 02:04, 8 April 2020 (UTC)

I also urge editors to look out for promotional, unencyclopedic and unwikified text. These are usually signs of a copyvio. Darylgolden^(talk) Ping when replying 02:15, 8 April 2020 (UTC)

In Help_talk:Citation_Style_1#Citing_native_scripts_of_the_author's_name_and/or_title_of_a_work_in_Citation_Style_1 I inquired about the ability to include native scripts of titles of works and of authors. It turns out the citation template does allow input of native scripts of titles, but it does not have this capability for authors yet. In Chinese studies it is useful to know the hanzi of an author for a Chinese language works, so I suggested allowing the ability for native scripts of authors too. WhisperToMe (talk) 22:46, 15 April 2020 (UTC)

Hello there. This is an invitation to join the

@Sculture65, Justanothersgwikieditor, and Robertsky: Hi, I would like advice on updating the Penal Code to the new amendments as stated in the latest Criminal Law Reform Act passed in 2019. Would anyone be able to advise me on how to do it without copying the whole text? Help will be appreciated for this. Thanks. TheGreatSG'rean (talk) 16:49, 4 May 2020 (UTC)

Pinging @Sgconlaw: for advise on law related articles. --Justanothersgwikieditor (talk) 01:43, 5 May 2020 (UTC)

Hi there, recently, there have been disputes over a local radio page,

@

WP:NOTDIR applies. Not everyone listed is notable. Instead, the article should be fleshed out with the history of the station, controversy if any. Radio station articles in other countries are typical short. I don't know why, but Singapore IP editors tend to dump information here without value-adding. robertsky (talk

) 14:20, 29 March 2020 (UTC)

@Robertsky: Thanks for the update. I guess it'll be better to leave the pages as it is (I've reverted to previous versions), and have someone qualified to make the necessary changes. Thanks. TheGreatSG'rean (talk) 14:29, 29 March 2020 (UTC)

@

Capital 95.8FM's talkpage. --Justanothersgwikieditor (talk

) 07:36, 30 April 2020 (UTC)

I'll see what I can do. Clearly there is a dispute there. I agree that this IP editor needs to be referred. Thanks. TheGreatSG'rean (talk) 07:38, 30 April 2020 (UTC)

@TheGreatSG'rean: Started the conversation on his talkpage and suggested a compromise. Listing of DJs and their hosted segments. --Justanothersgwikieditor (talk) 07:48, 30 April 2020 (UTC)

@TheGreatSG'rean: Quite obviously conversation does not went well, IP editor is now blocked. --Justanothersgwikieditor (talk) 01:30, 11 May 2020 (UTC)

Hi all, Wikipedia Library recently has a couple of new partnerships that enable us editors to access paywalled reliable sources. One of them is ProQuest, which through it we are able to access Straits Times' archive among many other newspapers' archives. This will be useful to verify information for Singapore related articles.

Do note that to access the platform, you have to meet the following requirements:

• You have an account that is a minimum of 6 months old
• You have made a minimum of 500 edits
• You have made at least 10 edits to Wikimedia projects in the last month
• You are not currently blocked from editing Wikipedia
• You do not already have access to the resources you’re applying for through another library or institution

– robertsky (talk) 14:41, 11 June 2020 (UTC)

@Robertsky: Fun fact: ProQuest is actually available through NLB. Darylgolden^(talk) Ping when replying 11:00, 1 July 2020 (UTC)

I've come across a number of Mandarin TV and film actor BLP articles that have been the subject of edit-warring by Singapore IPs and a particular troublesome Malaysian editor (Special:Contributions/2001:d08::/34). However, I've noticed that the filmogs in these articles are largely unsourced. They also have unnecessary Chinese translations of notes (e.g., at Ya Hui, "Supporting role 女配角" repeatedly). Awards are similarly uncited (e.g., Carrie Wong#Accolades). There is also questionable phrasing and improper capitalization (e.g., at Bryan Wong#Filmography, "1/5 of the Male Lead 五大男主角之一"). —[AlanM1(talk)]— 02:34, 27 October 2019 (UTC)

I noticed too. Just don't have the capacity to sort out the facts in there. What would be your suggestion to take on issue at hand? robertsky (talk) 05:20, 27 October 2019 (UTC)

I don't really have the necessary subject knowledge or Chinese language skills to sort it out. I'm hoping to find editors here who care about those articles and maintaining enwiki's standards for them because it seems like there is probably a lot of work to be done. A lot of this is being done by persistent anonymous editors who are mostly interested in posting as much as possible wherever possible about their favorite whatever, without regard for Wikipedia and it's purpose and standards. Some have already been tagged as needing citations, which have been ignored. If we were to start removing that uncited content, it would probably be considered disruptive, so I don't know what to do. —[AlanM1(talk)]— 07:41, 28 October 2019 (UTC)

I contemplated cleaning up Singapore's drama series, actors, TV related pages before but it requires either a big cleanup or need to stub the page and redo everything again. Compared to US TV series and actors, sg TV related pages are a fine mess. We can slowly remove items like unnecessary Chinese translations first (keep the Chinese names for the drama and their roles name though) then revamp their filmography and awards sections. Citations usually can be found online as the local news cover the Star Awards quite a fair bit, it is quite a fair amount of work though. I try to spend a bit of time here and there on such articles. --Justanothersgwikieditor (talk) 01:42, 29 October 2019 (UTC)

Precisely, lots of work to do on this. Let's queue this up as a to-do right after we settle the main Singapore article? robertsky (talk) 02:18, 29 October 2019 (UTC)

@AlanM1: @Justanothersgwikieditor: FYI, I have started cleaning up the actistes BLP at the moment. My goals are:

1. to get all the filmography and awards sections cited
2. format the content body to one which I generally see in other BLP articles:
   1. Early year and education (or Early year)
   2. Career
   3. Personal life

Indeed, there are a lot of work to do. Should we establish a checklist of sorts so that we don't duplicate our efforts? i.e. references for star awards wins, show credits, etc.

Also, we may need to put a notice on all the artistes's articles to notify at least the IP editors (if they are reading) or to go the extent of establishing RFCs, otherwise our good work may come undone. I had been battling IP editor(s) whose changes are against MOS or the large consensus on

WP:BLP. robertsky (talk

) 00:30, 5 March 2020 (UTC)

@Robertsky: Can you link to the article that you have done up so we can use that as a guideline on the BLP? We can have a list of typical references for awards, TV shows etc. We might have to do up the Award shows or the TV drama series articles first as their references can be reused for the artistes' articles themselves. Of course a list of common references will be good and a checklist of which articles are done up etc will be good, so we know our progress or missed out any particular articles.

RFCs are typically wasted on IP editors. Its the lack of communication mostly on their side that whatever we do, is ignored. A notice will be sufficient but as long they want the wiki articles to be only in the style they want, we can only semi-protect them and hope they move on. --Justanothersgwikieditor (talk) 01:49, 5 March 2020 (UTC)

@Justanothersgwikieditor: I have done Lai Meng, it is a recently created article though. I stepped in to expand the article as another editor wanted to speedy delete the article. The updated article has ended up with a GA rating with 56.6% confidence on the Rater.js tool currently, but I have it rated to B cuz the filmography section is incomplete (and many of her earlier credits would only be available in offline media since she was active before 1998). Feel free to nitpick and edit on the article since there isn't anyone else updating it after I had expanded it. I am in progress of editing Tong Bing Yu, which is currently mostly uncited and in need of de-fluff for her Singapore activities and updates for her post-Mediacorp activities.

FYI, we have two to three groups of IP editors, Malaysia-based, Singapore-based and Indonesia-based. All three with different styling opinions, hence the constant undos by IPs in artistes BLPs. robertsky (talk) 02:51, 5 March 2020 (UTC)

@Robertsky: Noted, will try to help today~ --Justanothersgwikieditor (talk) 02:58, 5 March 2020 (UTC)

Just to add on here it will be good for us to create an official guideline for these film related articles, Which gives us something to reference when making the changes.

We can do that. However, let's draw on

WP:TV project since there are TV related content.. and oh... what do we have here... Wikipedia:WikiProject Film/Southeast Asian cinema task force, and... oh... this too! Wikipedia:WikiProject Actors and Filmmakers Heh. More resources to tap on! Fun! There seems to be a whole lot that we can apply from Wikipedia:WikiProject Council/Directory/Culture. robertsky (talk

) 15:59, 5 March 2020 (UTC)

@

1.02 editor: RfC in Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Singapore-related articles? robertsky (talk

) 13:54, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

Hi all, I decided to use this table version for the filmography section: (as taken from Jeanette Aw)

• The Notes column is removed as there is no other notable information here, but it can be included (between Roles and TV Network column) if there are other information such as whether the actor has other additional role in the production, such as being a producer, director or writer. The Notes column should not contain the information of the acting role itself, i.e. being paired up with which other character, whether role is a main, supporting or cameo one, etc. I feel that this information is sufficient in the TV Series pages. I went through other artistes and TV series articles from other networks, primarily
  requests relating to ABS-CBN
  ), these information are present only in the TV Series pages.
• I included a TV Network/TV Station column as there are some artistes being in TV Series that were first shown in different networks. Case in point,
  Mediacorp Channel 8, and soon in a yet to be named mainland Chinese network. This column is present in artiste pages relating to ABS-CBN
  as well.
• For the Ref column, it is hard to find references with much of the older references hiding behind paywalls or expired websites (i.e. omy.sg). I have resorted to using Mediacorp's Content Distribution portal or other potentially
  WP:PRIMARY
  sources for some of the referencing work. Personally, I don't see an issue as these references are supporting several factual statements: the show title that the artiste has acted in, the role(s) that the artiste has portrayed, and the network the show belongs to.

Do let me know if any of you have comments, suggestions, criticism, etc. I will be updating the other artistes' tables one by one after Jeanette Aw is done. robertsky (talk) 13:53, 31 May 2020 (UTC)

Note: See conversation on User talk:Manwë986 as well. robertsky (talk) 15:04, 3 June 2020 (UTC)

Hi, the table looks great and I am in agreement with your proposed design. --Justanothersgwikieditor (talk) 07:08, 4 June 2020 (UTC)

@Manwë986: You referred to this section and then shifted focus on another talkpage section. While this may not be the best consensus, there are at least 2 agreements against your single argument on the formatting section. I agreed with Robertsky on The Notes column should not contain the information of the acting role itself, i.e. being paired up with which other character, whether role is a main, supporting or cameo one, etc. I feel that this information is sufficient in the TV Series pages. while on your talkpage, robertsky mentioned it is only a compromise, OK. Just a note, do understand that this is a compromise between you and me. My stand remains the same. If there are other editors move ahead with removing the information in the Notes column, I will support them., I had already stated my support here and in the edit summaries of Chen Liping. --Justanothersgwikieditor (talk) 01:25, 24 July 2020 (UTC)

@Drmies: With reference to the above discussion and on your talk page archive, I like you to chip in your comments if any. Thanks! --Justanothersgwikieditor (talk) 01:25, 24 July 2020 (UTC)

In regards to Chng Suan Tze and Teo Soh Lung I wonder if their Chinese names have been recorded. It would be great to include in the article. WhisperToMe (talk) 21:16, 21 April 2020 (UTC)

@WhisperToMe: Chng Suan Tze is 庄瑄芝 and Teo Soh Lung is 张素兰. It was hard to search their Chinese names lel. needed to do some hardcore googling. - Hongsy (talk) 15:49, 19 July 2020 (UTC)

Moved from Wikipedia talk:SGpedians' notice board § AHTC case against the Workers Party

I'd say it's a major political lawsuit, but there isnt a separate article? Could someone familiar with the case start one please? I am willing to help, but starting from scratch is quite a challenge to me as I dont know much and dont have access to much resources on Singapore.--RZuo (talk) 15:22, 11 July 2020 (UTC)

The Ang Mo Kio article has a lengthy but completely unsourced story about a Lady Jennifer Windsor in the 1920s being the ang moh of Ang Mo Kio, but I've been unable to find any evidence at all that such a person existed. If you can help solve the mystery either way, please chip in at Talk:Ang_Mo_Kio#Is_"Lady_Jennifer_Windsor"_a_hoax?. Jpatokal (talk) 09:42, 23 July 2020 (UTC)

Hi everyone, I am currently working on creating entries for Chinese dialect terms used in Singapore on Wiktionary. However, there are some terms that I do not know so if anybody here is fluent in any of the Chinese dialects spoken in Singapore, please head over to Wiktionary to contribute. Currently, we have entries for Singaporean Hokkien, Teochew and Cantonese in the dialectal tables, so please contribute those if you know, but if anybody speaks Singaporean Hakka, Hainanese or Foochow, we can always ask one of the admins to add one of those to the dialectal tables. Thanks, and I hope to see more of you at Wiktionary. The dog2 (talk) 02:42, 24 July 2020 (UTC)

Hello, I would like to propose a merger of two project pages:

• Wikipedia:SGpedians' notice board → Wikipedia:WikiProject Singapore
  , and
• Wikipedia:WikiProject Singaporean places → Wikipedia:WikiProject Singapore
  .

@AquaDTRS: Let's split the proposal up? The noticeboard move proposal might take a longer time to resolve since both locations are in active usage, where the places project is inactive and it should be easier to reach a consensus. – robertsky (talk) 05:10, 28 July 2020 (UTC)

Sounds good. I have separated the discussions below. -- AquaDTRS (talk) 07:31, 28 July 2020 (UTC)

Merger discussion of Wikipedia:SGpedians' notice board

Counter-Propose I would like to counter propose, in which Wiikpedia:SGpedians' notice board is redirected to Wikipedia:WikiProject Singapore, but the reverse is done for the talk page. This is as the current page now is more actively used for discussions and should be centralised here, whereas someone looking for the project page would search Wikipedia:WikiProject Singapore instead. furthermore WT:SG already redirects here instead of Wikipedia Talk:WikiProject Singapore so if anyone is looking for the talk page they would be brought here. Pentagon 2057 (T/C) 03:11, 28 July 2020 (UTC)

@

request a move to swap the two talk pages to keep the watchers, whilst dropping the notice board. – robertsky (talk

) 05:08, 28 July 2020 (UTC)

I think its better for both the project page and talk page to have the same name. When the dust settles, WT:SG will redirect to the only page remaining, so that won't be an issue. As for the watchers, a round-robin page swap before the merge would be a good idea as watchers of both pages will see the page move of the page they are watching. In any case, these are logistic issues we would have to iron out, but it seems like both of you are in favour of a merge. -- AquaDTRS (talk) 07:31, 28 July 2020 (UTC)

Yes, although the final destination of the page is still up for discussion I believe that they ought to be combined. Simplifies things and makes it less confusing for non-SG editors. Pentagon 2057 (T/C) 12:40, 28 July 2020 (UTC)

The two talk pages should definitely be combined since they essentially serve the same function. I would think that redirecting the other talk page here makes more sense since this is the more active page. {{Editnotice central redirected}} should probably be placed on whichever talk page gets redirected to prevent confusion. ~ KN2731 {talk · contribs} 13:19, 28 July 2020 (UTC)

Oh yes, I meant that we

round-robin swap the pages so that the more active page (currently this) is now named Wikipedia Talk:WikiProject Singapore and then we merge the less active page into the more active page. -- AquaDTRS (talk

) 20:13, 28 July 2020 (UTC)

• Merge No preference to keeping which project but definitely merging less active project to more active project. --Justanothersgwikieditor (talk) 01:16, 29 July 2020 (UTC)

Since it's been a week and there haven't been any strong opposition against the merger, I'm going to try moving forward with closure and a merge. I'll formalize the process a bit more by writing it out what is planned to be done for the merger:

• Main page: Merge
  Wikipedia:SGpedians' notice board → Wikipedia:WikiProject Singapore
  . Mostly cleaning up and removing duplicate templates/sections. The page will have to be reorganized.
• Talk page: Before merging, the more active page is [Wikipedia talk:SGpedians' notice board]. To ensure that the more active page is titled
  WP:ROUNDROBIN swap the two pages. This also has the added benefit of notifying everyone watching the pages about the merger as discussed above. Then merge [Wikipedia talk:SGpedians' notice board] → Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Singapore
  .
• Subpages: There are
  Wikipedia:SGpedians' notice board/SGCOTF
  pages which have very small subsubpages. Maybe they can be merged into a single page first to reduce the number of pages to be created after the merge, or because they are historical pages maybe they don't have to be moved. I'm unsure about this one.
• Cleanup: Mostly updating wiklinks on pages and templates like on {{WikiProject Singapore}} to avoid a redirect (where avoiding one is beneficial). Not sure if there are more things to be done but this is what I currently thought of.

-- AquaDTRS (talk) 05:11, 5 August 2020 (UTC)

For the subpages, I suggest moving them as well but move those which are of significant use / importance / showing signs of being used first. Even if they are historical pages, they might be deleted if there is a cleanup of subpages of defunct/merged Wikiprojects and we lose them. Maybe it is fine to lose them but I prefer to keep them as a record/archive. --Justanothersgwikieditor (talk) 02:16, 6 August 2020 (UTC)

Merger discussion of Wikipedia:WikiProject Singaporean places

I'm planning an edit request for changes to be made to the {{WikiProject Singapore}} banner as part of the Wikipedia:WikiProject Singapore merger as discussed above. Consensus is required to make controversial edit requests to protected templates and edits to the banner is potentially one of these, which is currently transcluded on 11148 pages. I've started a discussion at Template talk:WikiProject Singapore#Proposed edit request following merger of Wikipedia:SGpedians' notice board to gather consensus for the edit request. -- AquaDTRS (talk) 02:55, 6 August 2020 (UTC)

I noticed that pages of Singaporeans have adopted naming templates that are associated with the manner that the Singapore government defines 'race'. For example, I see that K Shanmugam's name is referred to as an 'Indian name' when there is no such thing as an 'Indian name' and not every Singaporean with an 'Indian name' are descendants of Indians (e.g. Sri Lanka). Almost every nationality has a name template for their country (Indonesia, the Philippines, Vietnam, etc), hence I think Singapore should have its own name template as well. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Gandalfett (talk • contribs) 08:00, 4 July 2020 (UTC)

@Gandalfett: I am ambivalent at the moment. However, do expect push back from other editors who prefer to define the names along generalised ethnic lines still. – robertsky (talk) 08:08, 4 July 2020 (UTC)

@Gandalfett: Also, tread carefully. I believe there is a sockpuppet and their accounts being banned for pushing {{Singaporean name}} template without consensus. See deletion logs of this template. – robertsky (talk) 06:41, 5 July 2020 (UTC)

Putting aside the point about the name of the template {{

Indian name}} being underinclusive, I’m not seeing how a template like {{Singaporean name}} is supposed to work. There is too much variation, and most of it will be along ethnic lines and thus a duplication of {{Chinese name}}, {{Malay name}} and so on. — SGconlaw (talk

) 06:47, 5 July 2020 (UTC)

Personally, since Singapore is suppose to be a multi-ethnic, multi-cultural country, I think that we shouldn't be defining our citizens heavily based on ethnic lines, with no mention about Singaporean naming customs. I am surprised that the 'Indian name' template wasn't created by a native Indian but instead a Singapore Chinese (inference from username) based on his own interpretation of 'Indian'. It seems like Singapore has become a very racialised society. For the {{Chinese name}}, many Singaporeans have given names separated into two (e.g the PM's given name is Hsien Loong) and many readers would think that the PM's given name is Hsien. Maybe we can implement our own template to emphasize the correct way of addressing the given name. Gandalfett (talk) 11:53, 7 August 2020 (UTC)

@Gandalfett: Not defending anyone here, but just that the number of active Singapore based editors is likely an extremely small population and invariably may not be not well represented either by race or gender. Do suggest an appropriate hatnote text and format for your version of the template. You will have to at least account for the differences in the naming schemes of the 3 major race/cultures here, and most probably conduct a RfC to formalise a consensus as well given the troubled history of the {{Singaporean name}} here. – robertsky (talk) 12:42, 7 August 2020 (UTC)

@Robertsky: Thanks. I have made some hatnotes on my user page. You may refer to the page and add comments to it. Your feedback will be appreciated. Gandalfett (talk) 17:11, 7 August 2020 (UTC)

@Gandalfett: I suggest that you place your versions here instead where there are more watchers than on your user page. – robertsky (talk) 17:33, 7 August 2020 (UTC)

Hey there. Just found this Wikipedia discord server and thought of inviting those involved in WikiProject Singapore to join in. Hope the server will bring us closer and bring more fruitful discussions on articles related to Singapore.

Hope to see you all there!

Join Server

--ZKang123 (talk) 13:10, 12 August 2020 (UTC)

There is a current RFC on removal of certain content in Singapore artistes BLP articles that the project may be interested in weighing in: Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Content in Notes column of filmography tables in Singapore artistes BLPs. – robertsky (talk) 01:15, 5 August 2020 (UTC)

@

1.02 editor: Hi all, as both of you commented on the original discussion on Singapore artistes BLPs, please comment on the RFC if you like to weigh in. Thanks --Justanothersgwikieditor (talk

) 03:08, 6 August 2020 (UTC)

@Manwë986: Hi! Please do give comments on the RFC as well. Thanks! --Justanothersgwikieditor (talk) 03:08, 6 August 2020 (UTC)

Hi project members, would like your inputs on this. Thanks! – robertsky (talk) 14:17, 17 August 2020 (UTC)

I have nominated

• For Singaporeans with a patronymic name (optional naming customs/order/system)

Please refer to template:Singaporean name for your reference. Your feedback on the improvement of this template before making a vote would be appreciated. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Gandalfett (talk • contribs) 18:52, 7 August 2020 (UTC)

• I agree that Singaporean names are unique in a sense that a standalone template would help address the issue of not dividing names along ethnic lines and some form of standardization is preferred. However, the above implementation looks tedious because an editor who is going to tag the hatnote has to first recognize that both Chinese/Eastern or patronymic type names can originate from Singapore which requires use of a different template, and then further dissect the make-up of the name in order to decide which parameters to use to trigger the right hatnotes to appear. This might not be intuitive to editors unfamiliar with the names from Singapore. Also, the primary purpose of the hatnote is to notify the reader on how the subject of a biography is going to be addressed, which is typically the last name/family name unless otherwise stated (see
  MOS:SURNAME
  ). So I think it would simplify things by only stating that it is a Singaporean name and how that person should be addressed, something like

• This is a Singaporean name. The family name is (X). (following the convention of addressing people by surname/last name)
• This is a Singaporean name whose last name is patronymic. The person should be referred to as (X) (if not surname/last name then address by...)

-- AquaDTRS (talk) 02:13, 8 August 2020 (UTC)

@AquaDTRS: Thanks for your feedback! I just realised my mistake and made some changes to the hatenotes. I used Template:Indonesian name as a reference for the second and third hatnotes. Gandalfett (talk) 03:39, 8 August 2020 (UTC)

• @Gandalfett: 1. Why do you have to jump the gun and create the template? Now, there is a TfD for it. 2. Do not change/replace/add the template to the mainspace articles before consensus is met, otherwise editors may take it as being disruptive. 3. Your RfC isn't formatted properly, according to what has been outlined here? no {{rfc|<category>}}</ref>, neutral statement/question, etc? Without this formatting, your RfC will not be shown up in the wider wiki community.

Now, onto the hatnote itself, I don't think there is a need for a separate {{

Indian name}} templates are in, Category:Hatnote templates for names, the templates are mainly reflecting alternative naming conventions to the convention of <first name> <middle name> <last name/surname>. Despite the advances in establishing racial harmony, I don't think that cultures and traditions are still that well-mixed or blurred enough in Singapore to simply whitewash naming conventions, ignoring the fact that the names are rooted by the ethnicity of the person. The necessity of the {{Singaporean name}} template would probably be more pertinent in the future when notable BLPs with double barrelled surnames turning up on wikipedia. – robertsky (talk

) 11:02, 9 August 2020 (UTC)

• @Gandalfett: I noticed the contents of your comment above have been modified - please don't edit comments after they have been posted; it's typically bad form to edit them after someone has replied to them. If you anticipate needing to make adjustments after, consider editing it in your sandbox instead (i.e. User:Gandalfett/sandbox)

With regard to the hatnote, I am still agreeable with having a standalone template if it addresses both issues of informing readers on the name used to address the biography's subject and your initial concern of not categorising people by ethnic lines. However, as you can see, this is going to be challenging because not only does the template need to conform to Wikipedia standards, it also has to address everyone's concerns of what the template does and whether the template should exist given the other templates that are already present on the Wiki.

On the main issues with the current template, I think as robertsky has pointed out, the naming custom is rooted in a person's ethnicity and it is unavoidable to have to define the naming custom in the new template. This makes it kind of redundant in purpose to {{

Indian name}} which are trying to do the same thing. If the purpose of the template is to create a wrapper for Singaporean names as with {{Indonesian name}}, then as pointed out in the TfD, there needs to be a way for people to find out what a 'Singaporean name' is by looking at a guideline or an article. Currently there isn't one for Singapore (see {{Personal names}}), so trying to change the hatnote is going to look like an unsourced edit on each page. Even then, having one of those articles doesn't necessarily require its own naming template. A counterexample is {{Malaysian name}}, which does not have its own template even though Malaysian names

has its own article.

Also, not every page needs the hatnote if the last name of the full name is the family name/name of address, so the purpose of the hatnote should not be to try breakdown the name of each Singaporean biography.

Moving forward, you can try involving people from Wikipedia:WikiProject Anthroponymy too, they might have an idea of how such a template can be realized (or not). -- AquaDTRS (talk) 20:33, 9 August 2020 (UTC)

Votes

• Support Gandalfett (talk) 06:38, 9 August 2020 (UTC)
• Not supported – robertsky (talk) 11:02, 9 August 2020 (UTC)
• Not supported --Justanothersgwikieditor (talk) 08:35, 11 August 2020 (UTC)
• Support --Sgpore (talk) 08:06, 8 September 2020 (UTC)

From 1 October to 31 December, Women in Red is running a virtual contest on Asian women. In November, this will coincide with Wikipedia Asian Month. We look forward to strong participation from all those interested in improving coverage of women from Singapore.--Ipigott (talk) 16:18, 21 September 2020 (UTC)

Hi all, I think Lee Kuan Yew has a pretty good article and is close to GA standards.Dawkin Verbier (talk) 06:36, 14 November 2020 (UTC)

Agreed, though it is very long and will likely need some tough, unsentimental editing to reduce it to comfortable length. Kohlrabi Pickle (talk) 08:00, 14 November 2020 (UTC)

I am trying to find a book or internet URL that confirms the details of Voiceover Unlimited's Singapore English dub of Yu-Gi-Oh! and/or other Singapore English dubs like those of One Piece or Detective Conan. I tried to find if Voiceover Unlimited ever had a website, but such never appeared. Do libraries in Singapore have this info? WhisperToMe (talk) 17:42, 23 December 2020 (UTC)

It would be hard pressed to find news about such stuff in the mainstream media then here, which the library would have archived. A search for Odex or Voiceover Unlimited in the newspaper archive seems to turn up nothing on this. https://eresources.nlb.gov.sg/newspapers/Digitised/Search?ST=1&AT=search&k=Voiceover%20unlimited hilarious as it is, I think you would have to trawl through archived versions of online news portal such as yahoo Singapore or lycosasia even on waybackmachine for such news long gone. Good luck. – robertsky (talk) 02:40, 24 December 2020 (UTC)