Talk:1 Esdras
defunct . |
Bible Top‑importance | |||||||
|
Ancient Near East Low‑importance | |||||||
|
Books | ||||
Organization
It didn't make much sense to me that the
203.32.87.174 15:07, 7 October 2006 (UTC) See http://net.bible.org/dictionary.php?word=Apocalyptic%20Esdras
Relation of 1 Esdras to Septuagint
The last sentence of this paragraph doesn't make sense to me:
- Josephus makes use of the book and some scholars believe that the composition is likely to have taken place in the first century BC or the first century AD. Many Protestant and Catholic scholars assign no historical value to the "original" sections of the book. The citations of the other books of the Bible, however, provide a pre-Septuagint translation of those texts, which increases its value to scholars.
How does a 1st century BC/1st century AD text pre-date the Septuagint? Perhaps the author meant the existing manuscripts of 1 Esdras pre-date the existing manuscripts of other biblical texts cited within 1 Esdras? As it stands this paragraph is quite confusing. Timotheos 01:33, 24 December 2006 (UTC)
There really ought to be a citation on the last paragraph where it says that early Christians quoted it often. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Squeoo (talk • contribs) 22:14, 15 December 2007 (UTC)
Ethiopian Orthodox Bible
An anonymous editor has mentioned an Ethiopian Orthodox Bible. What edition is this Bible exactly? Do you have an ISBN? Some other reference,perhaps? Rwflammang (talk) 17:51, 4 January 2008 (UTC)
Original Language
This article seems to be a bit unclear as to the original language of the book.
Dead link
During several automated bot runs the following external link was found to be unavailable. Please check if the link is in fact down and fix or remove it in that case!
--
External links modified
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
I have just modified one external link on 1 Esdras. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
- Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20070928122338/http://www.episcopalian.org/pbs1928/articles/AnglicanTeaching/042.htm to http://www.episcopalian.org/pbs1928/articles/AnglicanTeaching/042.htm
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.
This message was posted before February 2018.
{{source check
- If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
- If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.
Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 21:42, 16 June 2017 (UTC)
Jerome and Ezra
I have reverted the following edit for the second time; so I owe an explanation: "Jerome states that this book is apocryphal along with 2 Esdras.[1] "
In his prologue to Ezra, Jerome discusses four 'books of Esdras' known in Latin; and explains why his translation (from the Hebrew) contains only one. As usual his argument in't entirely easy to follow; as he is purusing disputes of which we only have his half of the story. But it is clear that he criticises the Seputagint Greek for presenting two books of Ezra that are in fact a 'variety of versions' of the same Hebrew original. Clearly he understands Esdras A (first Esdras) and Esdras B (second Esdras) here. Then he says that the third and fourth books of Esdras are apocryphal. Bogaert discusses which are these two books; and proposes that Jerome's third Esdras is to be identified with Slavonic 'third Esdras' - which also appears to be Ambrose's 'third Esdras'. Jerome's 'fourth Esdras' could then be our 5 Esdras, or 6 Esdras (or conceivably both). But either way, Jerome is not saying that our 1 Esdras is apocryphal, only that it is a secondary (and inferior) translation. Which indeed it is. TomHennell (talk) 19:39, 15 May 2019 (UTC)
- Clearly there is a confusion here; but Bogaert's findings are now defintive; 1 Esdras is never called 3 Esdras before the 13th century, so Jerome cannot have been referring to it as 'third Esdras' in his prologue to Ezra. On the other hand, 2 Esdras (= Clementive 4 Esdras) is referred to by Ambrose and "the third book of Esdras" in 'De Spiritu Sancto 2.6'. Again following Bogaert. TomHennell (talk) 23:37, 15 May 2019 (UTC)
theories of David Carr
I have reverted the attached from the lede.
"1 Esdras (
It looks like this ought to be in the body of the article; but not in the lede as it is not a consensus view. But also, unless I read it wrong, the wording is arsey-versey. Nehemiah does not feature in 1 Esdras; that is the point. TomHennell (talk) 16:12, 20 June 2019 (UTC)
References
- ^ David M. Carr, "The Formation of the Hebrew Bible: A New Reconstruction", Oxford University Press, 2011, pp168-169.
Incorrect claim about chronological recount? (Et. More needed for 'Criticism' section)
"An additional difficulty with the text appears to readers who are unfamiliar with chiastic structures common in Semitic literature. If the text is assumed to be a Western-style, purely linear narrative, then Artaxerxes seems to be mentioned before Darius, who is mentioned before Cyrus."
As far as I can tell, Cyrus is mentioned before Artaxerxes, and Darius is mentioned next. Cyrus did come before both, but Darius I came before Artaxerxes I, so if it were Darius I mentioned, it would be non-chronological - however, if it means Darius II, this would be chronological, since he reigned after Artaxerxes I (And Artxerxes II reigned directly after Darius II, with Esdras being said to have been born after the reign of 'Darius' and during the reign of 'Artaxerxes', so this chronology would make much sense, but I digress). But point being, unless I'm sorely mistaken, the claim about the text quoted from the Wikipedia article at the beginning of this post is incorrect, and should be revised or deleted.
Secondarily, criticism claiming deeds of Nehemiah to have been translated over to Esdras in 'Esdras A' should be noted in the 'Criticism' section, if it exists - and if it does not, the mention of such criticism should be expunged from the introductory text of the article. Zusty001 (talk) 04:19, 19 February 2022 (UTC)