Talk:Mahō Sentai Magiranger

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Hikaru isn't an Ozu. He is the "student" of the Ozu dad Bragel, but it wasn't indicated he is blood related to any of the Ozus.

Should I change Hikaru to the Ozu family section, now he's part of the family? I'm not sure of changing it yet, as it may be some kind of spoiler. Chairoguma 03:04, 31 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I think we can consider him part of the family, as he marries Urara. Gladrius 13:41, 23 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Maybe I should start another section for this, but I'm wondering is he more powerful as Sungel or Magishine, and if the former is there some reason he only uses Magishine most of the time. Gladrius 13:44, 23 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Bah, I really wish there was a way to put speculation into the page since it's pretty clear that Wolzard is Brajiel. :P Nezu Chiza 07:08, 28 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

• Episodes 32-34 are a 3-parter that reveals more of Brajiel and the Wolzard's true identity...

This page is HUGE. Should the Infershia/Hades Beast/Hades Beastmen (and possibly the spells) be given their own page(s)? 63.204.72.28 02:33, 16 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I always found it strange that Hades God Wyvern's weapon was called a scepter. Recently, I saw a translation that said that he was wielding a spear (which, you can't deny that it DOES look like a spear). I mean, if he really is wielding a scepter, wouldn't it look more like a small mace or morningstar?--Mr Fink 02:41, 16 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Should I remove them? It might be the same footage, but that DUMB Jetix logo appears on a corner. Also, Wolzard had a picture already, the one with the Madou circle. Little Angry Brown Bear 07:52, 11 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Re: Pictures of Mystic Force

Yes. I say give Wolzard back his Madou Circle picture and take out the Necrolai and Morticon ones. If those two deserve pictures, at least let it be FROM Magiranger. Ditto for all the Jetix monster pictures that someone decided to add. --172.129.185.16 13:47, 14 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

• The pictures SHOULD be used, JETIX or no, just as long as the pictures are from the japanese footage - Fractyl
  • Actually, if there's a big "JETIX" logo in the corner, the image should not be used. That image is a Mystic Force character, not a Magiranger character. Ryūlóng 03:12, 31 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

That's NOT its name. "Number One" is just what the Magiranger say after finishing the formation. Every other source cites that it's MagiKing and MagiKing only. Also, NO JETIX PICTURES. Mystic Force images can go on the Mystic Force page, not in the Magiranger section. GreenNinja 21:11, 19 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Recently, all of the pictures of the Magiranger were removed from the page. These are the correct pictures, taken from episodes of Magiranger, but are falsely named after the characters in Mystic Force. Do not remove them, as they are in the correct place. Ryulong 01:55, 9 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

With a recent reversion, I was trying to figure out if the kanji for this character was correct. Here it says that "魔導馬バリキオン" translates as "Madōba Barikion". For some reason "魔導馬バリキオン" is parsed into romaji into a translator I use as "Mashirubeba Barikirion" with "shirube" meaning nothing ("Dark ? Horse Barikirion"). However, "魔術馬バリキオン" is parsed as "Majutsuba Barikirion" which means "Dark Magic Horse Barikirion". Should I just chalk this up to my online translator not being able to understand "Madōba Barikirion" in the kanji presented in the article?

Also, shouldn't "Barikirion" be transliterated as "Valkyrion"? Ryulong 06:09, 15 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Something I've been curious about for a while is are Isamu and Hikaru supposed to be more powerful in their Heavenly Saint forms, or their henshin forms? And if the former, is there some reason they have to use their henshin forms most of the time? Gladrius 13:47, 23 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I think they would be more powerful in their Henshin forms since they use this form to combat more of their enemies, although I'm not sure why Hikaru fought Drake in his Heavenly Saint form rather than his other forms. I still believe their henshin forms are more powerful since both Hikaru and Isamu entered battle against N Ma in their henshin forms.Unknown Dragon 20:21, 30 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Wouldn't the Heavenly Saints be considered Angels? I mean that's what the "gel" part of their names comes from like "Blagel" is a combination of "BLAze" and "anGEL", and "Raigel" "Rai the god of thunder" and "anGEL". —Preceding unsigned comment added by Unknown Dragon (talk • contribs)

That's just their name. And if this is about the "Nephilim" thing, just stop adding that. It's fancruft-ness, as it was never specifically stated ANYWHERE that the Ozu Family are nephilim because their father was Tenkuu Seija Blagel (Heavenly/Sky Saint Blagel). I reverted it the first time because I had a feeling you added it because you had just watched the ABC Family film "Fallen" which I did as well. While the Nephilim are the result of an Angel and a human having a child, Makito, Houka, Urara, Tsubasa, and Kai are not Nephilim. They are humans with the power of magic. Ryūlóng 22:50, 25 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I was aware of Nephilim before Fallen was brought on the air or even when it was advertised, the Heavenly Saints are angel-like so technically the Ozu siblings would be Nephilim. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Unknown Dragon (talk • contribs)

Regardless, the Heavenly Saints are NOT angels. They are powerful deities that live in another dimension and have magical powers that are given to the Ozu siblings. And because they are NOT angels, Isamu Ozu/Blagel is not an Angel, and his children with Miyuki are not Nephilim. "-gel" was just used by Toei for their names. They are not Angels in any sense of the word, none of them even look like the Christian conception of an Angel. They are elementals. And please remember to sign your posts with four tildes (~~~~). Ryūlóng 23:44, 25 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

So? They don't have to look like the normal concept to be angels (Sungel does resemble an angel though), heck Blagel looks like the exact opposite of an angel, he looks more like a devil than anything. But it isn't just their names that point them out as angels, Magitopia, the realm they live in, makes it obvious. In the show Magitopia has been referred to as "Heaven" and "the Realm of Heaven" and it opposite can be said about the Kedomono Realm (although the strange thing is I have watched videos of all of the episodes of Magiranger and the realm that N Ma and the Hades Beasts come from is never referred to as the Kedomono Realm, it's either referred to as Hades or Infershia, and Miyuki even referred to the place as Hell). It's quite obvious they were intended to be angels. ~—Preceding unsigned comment added by Unknown Dragon (talk • contribs)

But they aren't angels. If anything, they're gods and the Ozu would be demigods, similar to the Greek Pantheon. Ryūlóng 03:34, 26 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Then why not have a statement explaining how the Ozu Siblings are similar to both Nephilims and Demigods because of their heritage?Unknown Dragon 03:51, 26 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Because it is original research, and

Wikipedia is not a place for original research. Ryūlóng 03:55, 26 July 2006 (UTC)[reply

]

If it's in the show, include it. If it's based on something unrelated to the show and never mentioned at all in the show, it probably isn't applicable. Gladrius 13:35, 27 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I no they have not denied the fact that the Heavenly Saints are angels, and if they were, the siblings would technically be considered Nephilim. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Unknown Dragon (talk • contribs)

But it was not mentioned in the show explicitly that the Heavenly Saints are angels. So therefore, the Ozu siblings are not to be considered Nephilim unless it was explicitly stated that Isamu was an angel (not because his Heavenly Saint name is Burajeru/Buragel). Ryūlóng 02:01, 30 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

What is Snowgel's gender? At first Snowgel was referred to as he by Hikaru when he was explaining to the Ozu siblings to find her, but later on Snowgel is referred to as a female. Drake also used the derogatory term, "bastard" which is a term used towards males. Unknown Dragon 05:38, 26 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I believe Snowgel is female. Her adult form is very feminine, and one of the better fansites refers to Snowgel as a "she" [1]. Ryūlóng 05:58, 26 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I think Snowgel's a she, especially if we go by correlating the genders of the Rangers with their patron Saints. Gladrius 18:40, 26 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Why was this removed? Seeing as how not all the siblings have their abilities listed!!! Anyway, what's Makito's special ability?

• Kai = Alchemy
• Tsubasa = Potion Making
• Urara = Fortune Telling
• Houka = Transformations
• Makito = ??

24.14.120.92 23:45, 1 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

It was removed because it seemed like a fan question. Makito is an herbologist. Ryūlóng 23:46, 1 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

And their abilities are listed in the text already. Ryūlóng 00:26, 2 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

It seems that Magiranger has many wonderful and memorable quotes from the series, do you think we should create a Wikiquote section for Magiranger?Unknown Dragon 20:54, 4 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Well, we could use the Wikiquote template. What is the name of the page over on Wikiquote? Ryūlóng

Magi Wikiquote page- http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Mah%C5%8D_Sentai_Magiranger Feel free to put the template on the Magi page Grz 21:43, 5 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

And now it's in the article. Ryūlóng 23:42, 5 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

In the names and puns section of the article, Vamculia's name origin explicitly details each part of her name, yet throughout relevant articles, she is still refered to as "Vancuria", a mix of a transliteration of her name and the intended spelling. If we wanted to refer to her by transliteration, it should be "Vankyuria" or "Vamkyuria". If we want to refer to her seemingly intended name spelling, we should use "Vamculia".

I also propose we make mention of "Transylvania" contributing to the "-ia" in her name, as "Dracula" does not end in "-ia".

As far as Nigh & Mare go, I think it'd be proper to refer to them by the parts of the English word their names derive from: Nigh and Mare. One could argue that the Japanese pun of "Nai to Mea" should be preserved because "to" was used as an actual Japanese word meaning "and". However, "Nai" and "Mea" in those forms mean nothing but the transliteration of their names. "Nigh" and "Mare" make specific referance to the word their name comes from.

Likewise with Mandra Boy: his name clearly derives from "mandrake" or "mandragora". Neither have an additional "O" as "Mandora Boy" does, so why is it that his name is spelled like that here?

Star6phoenix9 04:25, 10 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

However, in all of these articles we only romanicize to the extent that other sources do so. This is why there is the Names/Puns section. "Nai to Mea" are their names, but yes, it's supposed to mean "Nightmare" which in kana is "Naitomea." The same goes for Vancuria; she would have been named Vamucuria if Toei wanted it, but in her original name was "Bankyuria" which we can only assume comes from "Vampire" and "Dracula", with some other changes. Similarly, Mandora is how his name is written in Japanese, and how various sources decided to translate it. The other things are all

original research, which Wikipedia cannot have. Ryūlóng 04:55, 10 September 2006 (UTC)[reply

]

Rylong is correct here... the romanisations used in this article are those used by outside sources, not those personally used by editors of Wikipedia. Thanks.--

T 05:12, 10 September 2006 (UTC)[reply

]

Star6phoenix9 05:41, 10 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

But the intended spelling is not what is used on this article, to an extent. We go by what other people go by. They have transliterated Bankyuria to Vancuria (I think I've seen Vanculia before, but that's not the point), and Mandora Boya to Mandora Boy, and Nai to Mea to Nai and Mea. While it may have been intended that the names are as such, those such names are not used by a majority of the people. If you have a resource that we can see マンドラ坊や, バンキュリア, and ナイとメア in the Roman alphabet from speakers of Japanese, then we may reconsider. Ryūlóng 05:50, 10 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

First, I want to clear up that transliteration means to take a word of one writing system and use another writing system to approximate the original word. Because English uses the Roman alphabet, we call it Romanization. "Vancuria" is not a transliteration of "Bankyuria" because they are both using Roman letters. Although, "Bankyuria" is a transliteration of "バンキュリア". What the spelling "Vancuria" actually is, is a guess at the intended meaning of "バンキュリア".

So, correct me if I'm wrong, but Wikipedia will only recognize "Vamculia" as the character's name if another site lists it as such, official or unofficial?

Star6phoenix9 06:02, 10 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Well, it's just that it's never been seen to be written as "Vamculia", mabye "Vanculia", but not with an m. Ryūlóng 06:51, 10 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

But we both know it should be an m if spelled as "Vanculia".

Star6phoenix9 07:09, 10 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Do we? Perhaps it was meant to be Vancuria or Vanculia, with no m, but Vancuria is used most in English sources. Ryūlóng 07:16, 10 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

No, we don't know for sure. The only for sure thing is that she can be called "バンキュリア" and "Bankyuria" or "Bamkyuria" without error. Although, there is more evidence to support "Vamculia" than "Vanculia", so there is no reason to call her "Vanculia".

As far as sources go, Space ALC is awesome for finding out how non-Japanese words are rendered in katakana. Using Space ALC, I'd like to show how one could confirm the spellings of the aforementioned names starting with "バンキュリア".

We suspect that the words "vampire" and "Dracula", and I personally also suspect "Transylvania", are combined to make the name "Vamculia", transliterated into Japanese as "バンキュリア". "Vampire", suspected to be responsible for the Vam- in Vamculia's name, can be approximated as "バンパイア" as shown here. The vam- in "vampire" and the Vam- in "Vamculia" are both approximated as "バン" ban. "Dracula", suspected to be responsible for the -cul- in Vamculia's name, can be approximated as "ドラキュラ" as shown here. The -cu- in "Dracula" and the -cu- in "Vamculia" are both approximated as "キュ" kyu. However, Dracula's name ends in "ラ" and not "リ", suggesting that the remaining parts of Vamculia's name are not taken from Dracula's name. If "Transylvania" is responsible for the "-ia" in Vamculia's name, then it is possible that the "L" in Dracula's name can still apply to the "リ" in Vamculia's name because "Transylvania" is approximated by "トランシルバニア" as shown here where the "-ia" in "Transylvania" is fused with the second "N" as "ニア". Taking the "L" in "Dracula" and replacing the second "N" in "Transylvania" with it, you would get "リ" ri, which can approximate the "-li-" in "Vamculia". One could say that the "バニ" in Transylvania's approximation "トランシルバニア" could be responsible for a "Van-" and "-i-" in the spelling "Vanculia". However, it is more likely that a "バン" at the beginning of another relevant word would be prefered over a "バナ/バニ/バヌ/バネ/バノ" in the middle of a word with relevance because a) the word we are trying to figure out also has "バン" at the beginning of it and b) the "N" sound in ナ, ニ, ヌ, ネ, and ノ is different than the "N" sound of "ン" whereas the latter is a nasle sound and the former are not. In Kanji & Kana: A Handbook of the Japanese Writing System, it says on page 12 that when ン appears before labials, it is phonetically assimilated to m. Altogether, when we bring バン vam, キュラ cula, and ニア nia together, fusing the ラ la and ニ ni into リ li, we get バンキュリア Vamculia. Furthermore, Vamculia's appearance is that of a vampire, so all of the words "vampire", "Dracula", and "Transylvania" are relevant.

The arguement over "ナイとメア" is whether to render it as "Nai and Mea" or "Nigh and Mare". Of course, it is a pun on the Japanese approximation of "nightmare" which is "ナイトメア". (Space ALC uses varients of "nightmare", but the different syllable combinations are interchangable.) "Nai" and "Mea" are simply how English-speaking countries would render the Japanese writing "ナイ" and "メア". A transliteration by itself has no meaning. It simply serves as a guide to reading the non-Roman script. Although, we know that "ナイ" approximates the "nigh-" in "nightmare" and "メア" approximates the "-mare" in the same word. The pun comes in effect when one says either "ナイとメア" or "ナイトメア". Without context clues, you don't know what is being refered to unless it is written down or there is a presence of visual clues. As far as the girls' names actually being "Nai" and "Mea", we have no evidence to support that we are supposed to translate their names in the same way as their names would be transliterated, but we have evidence to support that "Nigh" and "Mare" would be logical translations.

Interestingly enough, マンドラ坊や's name is probably not from the word "mandrake" which is approximated as "マンドレーク". Instead, "mandragora" (also listed) was probably the contributing word, approximated as "マンドラゴラ". It shares the "マンドラ" part with "マンドラ坊や". Thus, "マンドラ坊や" can safely be translated as "Mandra Boy". Mind you, the transliteration is still "Mandora Bōya". Also, Mandra Boy's appearance and role is very similar to mandragoras, making the creature relevant to the etymology of "マンドラ坊や".

How's that for sources cited? Or are you in search of specific referances to the characters themselves?

Star6phoenix9 09:19, 10 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The characters themselves. Ryūlóng 09:57, 10 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Even if the majority sources using the same name are proven wrong? ...or even shown that the name they use is nonsensical?

Star6phoenix9 10:14, 10 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

It is not that someone is right and someone is wrong; it is just that the majority of English media concerning Magiranger uses a transliteration that is incorrect in your eyes, and it is this transliteration that has been used on this article since the series came out. Ryūlóng 10:18, 10 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

It's not the transliteration that is wrong, it's the translation that is wrong. Besides, it's called the "Intracoastal Waterway," but just because people will say it like "Intercoastal Waterway" doesn't mean that Wikipedia names the article

Intercoastal Waterway

. They know people will be inaccurate about it, so they redirect when people type the incorrect word.

Shoot, it's not that I think "Vancuria" is wrong, it's more that I think "Vamculia" is more accurate. I've shown how that is in detail, yet popularity somehow should outweigh evidence?

Star6phoenix9 11:13, 10 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Wikipedia has a guideline that states that the most common name should be used. Unfortunately, this means a translation that is more popular. Ryūlóng 21:08, 10 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Where exactly does it say to use the most common name? I'd much like to read what is also to be said around that guideline.

Star6phoenix9 21:38, 10 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I do not remember it right now. I think it's

WP:NAME. Ryūlóng 21:39, 10 September 2006 (UTC)[reply

]

Speaking of which, why don't we move this discussion to

WP talk:MOS-JA? Maybe bringing in some other Wikipedians would help settle this. jgp ^T_C 00:49, 11 September 2006 (UTC)[reply

]

Star6phoenix9 08:00, 11 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Okay, I have a question concerning this phrase. I know that Mandora Boy says this a lot after most of his sentences, does anyone know what this little catchphrase means? Unknown Dragon 01:31, 14 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

It's a (probably deliberate) grammatically incorrect combination of "de gozaimasu" and "desu" with a mispronunciation/typo thrown in. For one, "gozarimasu" itself is incorrect; the correct word is "gozaimasu". For another, "de gozaimasu" and "desu" are mutually exclusive; i.e. you only use one or the other. They both mean "is", and "de gozaimasu" is far more polite than "desu" (which is fairly polite itself). jgp ^T_C 02:38, 14 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Actually, I'm going to give a quick grammar overview here. The base form is "de aru", which is commonly contracted to "da". The polite form is "de arimasu", which is usually contracted to "desu". If you want to be formal, you can replace "aru" with "gozaru", resulting in "de gozaru" and the even more formal "de gozaimasu" (there are no contractions with "gozaru"/"gozaimasu"). Again, note "gozaimasu", not "gozarimasu". "Gozaru" is part of a very small class of verbs that are similar to the class "aru" is in, with two minor differences, one being the formation of the polite form. With "aru"'s class (called "godan"), the polite form is formed by replacing -u with -imasu. With "gozaru"'s class, the polite form is formed by replacing -ru with -imasu. If "gozaru" were a proper godan verb like "aru", the polite form would be "gozarimasu", but "gozaru" isn't a proper godan verb, and that's not the correct polite form. jgp ^T_C 02:39, 14 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Anyway, if anyone wants to take my explanation, clean it up (e.g. remove some of the tangents I went on), and stick it in the article, go ahead. jgp ^T_C 02:38, 14 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Cool, I was about to ask about this. Thanks! ReloadPsi 03:06, 14 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I can't help but think of "Aiyaiyaiyaiyai!" as a very rough equivalent to this :) —The preceding

unsigned comment was added by ReloadPsi (talk • contribs) 13:46, 17 February 2007 (UTC).[reply

]

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