Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Libana
- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was merge to Lubna of Córdoba. MBisanz talk 18:16, 23 January 2016 (UTC)
Libana
I can honestly find no evidence that this person exists besides that the feminist artist Judy Chicago featured her in her 1978 artwork on female artists through history, The Dinner Party. She also mentions her in her book on the artwork (which doesn't cite a source). I honestly now wonder if she didn't confuse the name or make her up or something.
I can find no translations of her poetry or philosophy online, no articles on her. Ms. Chicago's book mentions her, of course, and even gives a date of death (975), but has no citation. Searching reveals a few medieval people and places with that name or variants on it, and a feminist dance group, but no information about Libana herself. Am I going insane? I don't read Arabic or Spanish so it's very possible I just don't know where to look, but I'm getting worried about this.
I need to go soon so I wanted to mark this down for discussion before I log off here. Please note that, again, it's very possible that I am wrong about this. If reliable sources turn up to prove that I've become an unwitting tool of the patriarchy in suppressing the existence of this person, please anyone feel free to close the discussion immediately. Blythwood (talk) 08:22, 14 January 2016 (UTC)
- Note: This debate has been included in the ✈ 09:10, 14 January 2016 (UTC)]
- Note: This debate has been included in the ✈ 09:10, 14 January 2016 (UTC)]
- Note: This debate has been included in the talk) 15:55, 14 January 2016 (UTC)]
Merge with
- Comment: There are a few issues to consider, as mentioned at the refdesk thread. Firstly, Lubna of Cordoba are both said to have been poets and mathematicians in the 10th century; other details match as well. It seems obvious that the same person is meant by both names, especially since they seem to be alternate transliterations of the same Arabic word, yet that seems like OR and the sources for the identification on the web are not reliable. הסרפד (call me Hasirpad) 20:02, 14 January 2016 (UTC)]
- "Labana" is the name used in this Italian history of literature dated 1785. It could very well be that it is the dated Italian spelling of "Lubna", later still used in (1904) " Samuel P. Scott, The History of the Moorish Empire in Europe", the reference used in the following muslimheritage.com mentioning Labana of Cordoba. Regarding Aisha, the following link does no seem that it would be not reliable. Like our Aisha article they give 1009-1010 as a probable date of her death. Both poets would be rather near contemporary ( which perhaps could make sense in relationship with Lubna's library ). If Lubna died in 975 as some sources are suggesting then perhaps "Libana" could become a redirection for the sake of J. Chicago but it would be best that this linkage would be made clear somehow. --Askedonty (talk) 21:39, 14 January 2016 (UTC)
- Sounds like if we vote to keep or merge, by the end of this discussion we'll have lots to add to the article. Leaning MERGE based on what's been said so far.Thmazing (talk) 04:44, 15 January 2016 (UTC)
- Delete instead and mention briefly at Dinner Party if needed as this is certainly questionable, with there being nothing to suggest convincingly better. SwisterTwister talk 06:59, 15 January 2016 (UTC)
- Comment Judy Chicago's point was that every figure honoured in the Dinner Party deserves to be remembered, and I'm inclined to agree, with this twist. Either the individual satisfies WP criteria for her own article, or she gets a mention in our page on "Women who have a place setting at the Dinner Party and don't appear to have enough reliable information for a stand-alone biography". I'm inclined to think that this discussion has revealed enough to push Libana into the former category. Carbon Caryatid (talk) 17:03, 18 January 2016 (UTC)
- Comment: Does anyone here read Arabic? Ibn Bashkuwal's Sila §1413 is one of the primary sources of information about Lubna, according to this source, as is this source (§1589), whatever its proper name is. הסרפד (call me Hasirpad) 19:30, 18 January 2016 (UTC)
- ... and here is Casiri's extract from Ibn Bashkuwal's above-mentioned work (see introduction to the same, pp. 66–67), where he lists learned women of Muslim Spain, the first two being "Aischa" (d. AH 400, ca. 1009) and "Labana" (d. AH 374, ca. 984; cf. Lubna, d. AH 364 per Ibn Bashkuwal) whose biographical details match those of Lubna from the same source. (Miguel Casiri's Bibliotheca Arabico-Hispana Escurialensis is one of the sources of Juan Andrés work, the "Italian history of literature" previously mentioned, see [1].) הסרפד (call me Hasirpad) 22:14, 18 January 2016 (UTC)
- Redirect to Lubna of Córdoba. That Chicago's "Libana" is the "Labana" mentioned by early modern historians seems uncontroversial; identifying "Labana" with the historical Lubna, based on citations traceable to a common source, with minor typographical discrepancies (see Adam Bishop's comment at the refdesk), seems to be strightforward synthesis. (Note the three versions of her date of death, differing by one digit on the Islamic calendar: 975/364, 984/375 and 1009/395.) הסרפד (call me Hasirpad) 15:47, 19 January 2016 (UTC)
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.