Talk:Gulag

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Gulag article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic. New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help. Assume good faith Be polite and avoid personal attacks Be welcoming to newcomers Seek dispute resolution if needed Article policies Neutral point of view No original research Verifiability

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

Archives: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6Auto-archiving period: 3 months

Soviet Union: Russia / History Top‑importance

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Soviet Union, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics (USSR) on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Soviet UnionWikipedia:WikiProject Soviet UnionTemplate:WikiProject Soviet UnionSoviet Union articles Top This article has been rated as Top-importance on the project's importance scale. This article is supported by WikiProject Russia (assessed as High-importance). This article is supported by the history of Russia task force.

Human rights Mid‑importance

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Human rights, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Human rights on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Human rightsWikipedia:WikiProject Human rightsTemplate:WikiProject Human rightsHuman rights articles Mid This article has been rated as Mid-importance on the project's importance scale.

	Law Low‑importance
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Law, an attempt at providing a comprehensive, standardised, pan-jurisdictional and up-to-date resource for the legal field and the subjects encompassed by it.LawWikipedia:WikiProject LawTemplate:WikiProject Lawlaw articles Low This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Politics Low‑importance

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Politics, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of politics on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.PoliticsWikipedia:WikiProject PoliticsTemplate:WikiProject Politicspolitics articles Low This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

It is requested that a map or maps be included in this article to improve its quality. Wikipedians in Russia may be able to help!

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion:

• Korolev posle aresta 1938.jpg

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 11:37, 23 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

2600:1702:6D1:28B0:E519:291C:BD43:B615 (talk) 01:31, 20 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

"There were several camps outside the Soviet Union, in Czechoslovakia, Hungary, Poland, and Mongolia, which were under the direct control of the Gulag."

There is no source included. I am from that country and I have never heard about that. I tried find some information about it and nothing found. 46.125.249.118 (talk) 05:07, 20 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust_survivors#Refugees. That page section contains:

"After the German invasion of the Soviet Union, more than a million Soviet Jews fled eastward into the interior. The Soviet authorities imprisoned many refugees and deportees in the Gulag system in the Urals, Soviet Central Asia or Siberia, where they endured forced labor, extreme conditions, hunger and disease."

with references. If no one objects, I believe it is worth including here as well, especially considering the practice of imprisoning people merely trying to escape the violence of war. Jyg (talk) 20:12, 13 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for pointing my attention at that. I am currently checking the sources cited in that article. It seems two of them (out of four) do not mention Gulag at all. Paul Siebert (talk) 18:52, 14 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]

The mortality rate table comes from a Russian website, which itself reveals a clear Russian motivation in its texts on the page. There is no further evidence of the mortality rate, which would be the following: One-quarter figure in Applebaum: The Gulag, p. 24, pp. 211 and 619. The author's reference for this rate changes: sometimes it is all war years, sometimes the years 1941/1942. One-quarter figure also in Scherbakowa: Prisons and camps, p. 603 (reference: 1942). One-fifth is given in Werth: A brief historical outline of the Gulag, p. 108 (reference: 1942 and 1943) and in Schnell: Gulag als Systemstelle, p. 160 (reference: all war years).

The mortality rate in this article is not sufficiently dealt with historically. DaMe Lucie (talk) 16:03, 28 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The table comes official documents, There is nothing wrong with "a Russian website", which is of an international foundation in charge of rehabilitations. Appelbaum is hardly the final say, and so on. If you have specific suggestions what to add to the text, please state them clearly, and we may discuss them. - Altenmann >talk 20:07, 28 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Disclaimer: I am communist and lived in USSR until 12 years old.

No matter how hard I tried to play devil's advocate against myself, I could not find any major historian scientist's name or authoritative history text among the references. Prove me wrong. Araz Zeyniyev (talk) 23:09, 30 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Well, it works other way around in En-wiki: please state which references look suspicious for you and/or suggest better ones. About the statement that you dont see anything major or authoritative, well, this is your opinion, to which, of course, you are entitled, but we don't discuss wikipedians' opinions, only articles and references (because

wikipedia is not a forum). - Altenmann >talk 01:58, 31 March 2024 (UTC)[reply

]