Talk:Hum Dekhenge

This article is rated Stub-class on Wikipedia's content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects:

Pakistan Low‑importance This article is within the scope of WikiProject Pakistan, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Pakistan on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.PakistanWikipedia:WikiProject PakistanTemplate:WikiProject PakistanPakistan articles Low This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale. Songs This article is within the scope of WikiProject Songs, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of songs on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.SongsWikipedia:WikiProject SongsTemplate:WikiProject Songssong articles India Low‑importance This article is within the scope of WikiProject India, which aims to improve Wikipedia's coverage of India-related topics. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page.IndiaWikipedia:WikiProject IndiaTemplate:WikiProject IndiaIndia articles Low This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified one external link on Hum Dekhenge. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

• Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20130317050254/http://himalmag.com/component/content/article/3566-listening-to-faiz-is-a-subversive-act.html to http://www.himalmag.com/component/content/article/3566-listening-to-faiz-is-a-subversive-act.html

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018.

• If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
• If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 11:53, 8 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

see

does not apply since the defending body ain't the one being accused of, at the first place and that the campus is polarized along the issue, the student media body does not automatically gain anything by adopting an anti-faculty stance. Also, the defense has been well covered across a variety of reliable sources, in intricate details. ∯WBG^converse 09:50, 2 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

want to talk? 10:29, 2 January 2020 (UTC)[reply

]

Swarajya (as usual) doing dubious journalism--relaying Twitter feeds, while staying clear of making any bright-line observation. This quote applies.

Manindra was being evasive for a long while, taking much umbrage with the headline but was finally compelled into admitting (by another Twitter user) that the committee will indeed probe all complaints, including about the poem. Now that we know about Vashi's complaint about the poem, what does that tell you? Over here, he is more clear and explicitly mentions about probing whether the poem hurt religious sentiments. ∯WBG^converse 12:28, 2 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

want to talk? 18:14, 2 January 2020 (UTC)[reply

]

want to talk? 06:26, 3 January 2020 (UTC)[reply

]

I will wait until there's more transparency around the locus. Just a few days back, he had told LiveMint about how insensitive it was to read Faiz's poetry and how all accusations of inciting communal disharmony must be probed. ∯WBG^converse 06:46, 3 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

want to talk? 08:55, 3 January 2020 (UTC)[reply

]

• An INSPIRE Faculty is neither a PhD fellow nor a professor (and changing from a sourced wrong to an un-sourced wrong is weird) and I have been seeking ways to resolve the dispute w/o using niche jargon.
• Under Pakistan IP laws, Faiz has his copyright at-least until 2035 (1985 + 50 y). Whilst copyright is seldom respected in case of acclaimed poets, that's not a reason for us to violate relevant laws; a news-piece over The Hindu has specifically covered the grievances of Faiz's heirs around this locus. The entire poem along with all existing translations and transliterations thereof are copyrighted and hence might not be used over this article.
• DiplomatTesterMan might have missed the conversation bbetween me and Harshil169 in the above section.
• MassDestroyer might not be aware that the figure 50,000 is an urban legend, as is the hallowed part about wearing a black saree, with an intention to defy a ban. See this and this. ∯WBG^converse 06:13, 3 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I accept that the 50000 figure may be an urban legend but Iqbal Bano did turn up in an saree. Whether this was done with an intention to defy the ban or not is irrelevant, it did defy the ban. I think this is an important detail. And I'm failing to understand how one, while wearing an attire that is banned, did not intend to defy the ban. Obviously she knew the saree was banned and still wore it. MassDestroyer (talk) 06:29, 3 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

talk) 07:48, 3 January 2020 (UTC)[reply

]

Semi-protected edit request on 5 January 2020

This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

== Meaning and Interpretation ==

The title of the song "Hum Dekhenge" or "We will see is a promise. The promise of the poem is a promise that we will see a day where "mountains of injustice are "blown away like cotton." The poem goes on to describe that day, where the land rumbles like a heartbeat under the feet of the oppressed and lightning crackles over the heads of those in power. The poem's beginning deals with conventional themes such as injustice and oppression, then gives way to more overtly religious symbolism. Faiz writes that the idols will be lifted from the Kaaba - the Kaaba being the holiest site in Islam, located in Mecca. The poem goes on to describe a revolutionary inversion of power, where the pure hearted who were outlawed, or cast out, will be honoured and "seated on cushions." The crowns of those in power) will be thrown up in the air (alluding to a celebration) and their thrones will be cast low. The final stanza of the poem is the most religious in tone, declaring that the only name (essentially on people's lips) will that be of Allah and a great revolutionary cry of "I am Truth" will go up and people of faith will rule again. Faiz's description of the idols being lifted from the Kaaba echoes the coming of Muhammad and Islam, where Muhammad said to have personally destroyed all the idols in the Kaaba, returning it to the worship of the monotheism of Abraham and the prophets before him, In Islam the prophethood of Muhammad signals the end of the age of "jahiliyyah" or "barbarism," a period considered by Muslims to be one marked by darkness, brutality, injustice and ignorance.

Faiz's imagery draws from the rich descriptions in the Qur'an describing Qiyamah, the final Day of Reckoning (or Judgement), when, among other things, even seemingly insurmountable icons of intimidating strength such as mountains will vaporize and be exposed as impermanent and insignificant before Divine Justice. The day of revolution may represent a critical commentary on the nature of Zia ul Haq's regime. The poem ends on the promise of the day when people of faith rule, suggesting that people of faith are not currently ruling but idolatry rule. Faiz is, in effect, calling Zia ul Haq, a man who proudly rules in the name of Islam, a non-Muslim, and an idolator - a worshipper of power and not Allah. In Islam, the greatest sin that one can commit is to make associations with Allah (this interpretation of Hallaj's statement that resulted in his execution), and idol worship falls into this greatest of sins. From an Islamic point of view, there can be no greater judgment or insult to a ruler. The poem could therefore be considered a call to the faithful to overthrow Zia for this gravest of sins. Mukundmittal (talk) 06:46, 5 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

 Not done: please provide

t/c) 10:59, 5 January 2020 (UTC)[reply

]

Revdelete request

Moved from

User talk:Harshil169

Harshil169 You mean a poem by Faiz Ahmad Faiz is subject to such strict copyrights that it cannot appear on Wikipedia? I find that hard to believe. El_C 16:52, 15 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

(talk page watcher) El C, FYI, the song has been sung by many many artists and many versions released. Take a look here 6 renditions. IMHO we should have a lenient approach. What was the ask here ? DBigXrayᗙ 17:01, 15 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

To revdelete all revisions in the article. El_C 17:08, 15 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

El C, I see that already some versions are hidden. I don't think we need more revdels. I am sure the 1K content Harshil removed can't be the "entire" poem. So I am not sure if hiding that part was necessary. User:Ymblanter Can you clarify what exactly that 1K content, hidden recently was ? I think our article needs some popular phrase/ stanzas of the poem as quotes to be able to discuss the poem in a useful way. RS discussing the poem are also using the quotes of the poem. DBigXrayᗙ 17:49, 15 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I can not now find what I have hidden but if I remember correctly this was a full text of a poem which I believe was beyond fair use. Reasonable length quotes should be fine.--Ymblanter (talk) 18:25, 15 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Ymblanter, Indeed. Thanks for the kind reply. I will also copy this thread to the article talk page for future reference. DBigXrayᗙ 19:06, 15 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]