Talk:November 2013 North American storm complex

A fact from November 2013 North American storm complex appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the Did you know column on 2 December 2023 (check views). The text of the entry was as follows: Did you know... that a downed power line caused a fire spanning more than 100 acres (40 ha) during a November 2013 North American storm? A record of the entry may be seen at Wikipedia:Recent additions/2023/December. The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/November 2013 North American storm complex.

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• Lead=  Done
• Meteorological synopsis=  Done
• Impacts=  Done

Tails Wx 02:12, 20 October 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I am surprised to see a primary sources template/tag on this page. I just looked over all 103 sources present in the article (as of this message) and none are actually primary sources. If no one sees this message or responds to it within 48 hours, I’ll go ahead and remove the template. The Weather Event Writer (Talk Page) 14:45, 29 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

(Courtesy ping taggers,

WP:PRIMARY. —TheAustinMan^{(Talk ⬩ Edits)} 15:43, 29 December 2023 (UTC)[reply

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@

WP:LASTING and should be merged.47.19.68.110 (talk) 15:51, 29 December 2023 (UTC)[reply

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(reply to TheAustinMan) (EC) — Storm Events Database isn’t a primary source from what I was told in the past, as it goes through the initial reports (like law enforcement) then through the National Weather Service (signed off by the lead meteorologist) and then it is published 3-months later (about 75 days) by NCEI after it is verified and finalized. The info comes from a huge amount of sources. You can see the process described here: (Storm Data FAQ). I was assuming that was the cause for the primary source tag. But there may be other problems. Either way, WP:Weather considers Storm Events Database as well as most things published by NOAA to be secondary sources, which is why a ton of hurricane articles become GAs. If you and others think it is a primary source, then a larger-scale discussion that needs to take place to determine if it is primary or secondary and honestly at that point, determine what from NOAA is primary or secondary. For example, almost every NOAA source on Hurricane Walaka (a FA article) is a forecast discussion, which came out during the hurricane. Those are considered secondary sources from what I was told. So if those are secondary NOAA sources, Storm Events Database surely must be, given the 75 day process it goes through. I’m off-topic now, but if those are the only reason for the primary sources tag, then it can be removed. The Weather Event Writer (Talk Page) 15:53, 29 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I agree with TheAustinMan's analysis above. Literally every single source in this article are either primary sources released during the weather event, or government databases, fails

WP:SUSTAINED. The only secondary source in the article is The Weather Prediction Center's review of the event, and no other secondary or tertiary sources found. A merge to 2013–14 North American winter#Late November storm complex would be appropriate. ~ Tails Wx 16:25, 29 December 2023 (UTC)[reply

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