Talk:Slavic water spirits

I should also point out that samodiva has been described with serpentlike body and is sometimes conflated with the zmei, or "good dragon" in Bulgarian folklore, especially in songs about fairy brides. I also have found an instance of conflation the "evil dragon" lamia (St. George vs. lamia being substituted with the samodiva), althought that is just variant text and perhaps only an anomaly. --Kiyoweap (talk) 10:24, 19 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

talk) 18:11, 20 April 2018 (UTC)[reply

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You would have to make a better the case than "read Machal" to show that they are considered to be always closely associated with water. I dont think this Czech writer Machal is representative. It should be quite obvious you have to come up with sources that are more attuned to Bulgarian studies in order to be convincing. --Kiyoweap (talk) 18:43, 20 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

• Oppose (Merger proposal Samodiva (mythology) → Slavic water spirits). See sources. --Лобачев Владимир (talk) 03:50, 24 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

• (Samodiva) Samovila: Slavic goddess of woodlands. Samovila rules the forest and protects the animals that live within woodlands. She causes great harm to anyone who abuses her creatures. A shapeshifter, she can transform herself into any animal, and she teaches the skill to the devoted and faithful. Her knowledge of plants and herb medicine makes Samovila a favorite among kitchen Witches. — The Goddess Guide: Exploring the Attributes and Correspondences of the Divine Feminine

• (Samodiva) Vila. A female being peculiar to Serbian mythology is the Vila, who partakes of the characteristics of both the Fairy and the Elf. These Vilas, represented as Mountain Nymphs, live in the forests on the hills, and love singing and dancing. They are young and beautiful, with long flowing hair, and are usually clad in white. They often mount up into the air, from whence they discharge fatal arrows at men, but they injure none except those who intrude on their revels. — The Forest in Folklore and Mythology, p. 109

• Vila. Variations: Veela, Vilia, Vilya, Vilishkis, Vily, Willi In Serbian folklore, the vilas were the beautiful and young mountain NYMPHS clad in white; their voice was said to resemble the call of the woodpecker and was a warning of some mountain catastrophe, such as an avalanche. Vilas were known to carry off children whose mothers had, in a fit of anger, condemned them to the Devil or Hell. The vilas were said to injure those who interrupt their revelries as they dance beneath ... — Encyclopedia of Giants and Humanoids in Myth, Legend and Folklore

• Variations: RUSALKA, Samovily, Vily There is a Slavic myth that when a person is cursed by God or a child dies unbaptized, he will return as a type of vampiric fay known as a vila. When it returns, it will look like a beautiful little girl with long HAIR. Living in clouds, meadows, ponds, and trees, the vila, a very capable combatant, will attack lone travelers. — Encyclopedia of Vampire Mythology, p. 145

  --Лобачев Владимир (talk) 03:33, 24 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

"Variations: Rusalka"... It seems clear that we are having to do with the same category of nymphs which can be distinguished into various groups under different names. So, what is the meaning to keep completely unsourced and badly written standalone articles like "

talk) 12:58, 27 April 2018 (UTC)[reply

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The article cites the article of Mykola Mushynka from "Internet Encyclopedia of Ukraine", which is a dubious source. With the rise of nationalism in Ukraine thEre are quite a few "professors" popped up who laborously rewrite the old history of Ukraine, with claims bordering on nonsense. I do not know about this one, but his statement "first mention of Rosalia on Ukrainian territory is in the Primary Chronicle under 1067" is an easily verifiable falsification: there is no mention of Rosalia in Pr Chr under 1067. That said, I do not contest derivation of the term 'rusalka' from

Machal 1916 at p. 254 says that the name derives from Rusalye (i.e. Rosalia, p. 311).--

talk) 18:47, 20 April 2018 (UTC)[reply

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• Source.
  ISBN 5-7133-0704-2. --Лобачев Владимир (talk) 10:54, 20 April 2018 (UTC)[reply
  ]
  • Mathieu-Colas 2017 for Bogunki gives: "'petites déesses' qui attirent les imprudents dans les profondeurs des eaux (cf. les roussalki)". Thus they are the same as the Rusalky.--
    talk) 18:58, 20 April 2018 (UTC)[reply
    ]
    • No he does not say they are the same. Learn French :-) Also, obviously Mathieu-Colas describes the subject in his dictionary only superficially. There are native sources which known better.
      talk) 19:33, 20 April 2018 (UTC)[reply
      ]
    • Source:

1. STEJSKAL, Martin. Labyrintem tajemna. Praha: Paseka, 1991. ISBN 80-85192-08-X. S. 31. (in Czech)
2. BOHYNKA (in Slovak)
3. Kempiński A., Encyklopedia mitologii ludów indoeuropejskich, Iskry 2001. ​ISBN 83-207-1629-2​ (in Polish)
4. Podgórscy B. i A., Wielka Księga Demonów Polskich - leksykon i antologia demonologii ludowej, Wydawnictwo KOS, Katowice 2005. ​ISBN 83-89375-40-0​ (in Polish) --Лобачев Владимир (talk) 02:49, 23 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

• An example of personification of a product of human subconsciousness was the figure of the boginka, which only women in labour were supposed to see. This kind of vision was surely caused by puerperal fever, milk-fever shock or an illness, which was not associated. It is strange that the hoginka should be seen only by the lying-in woman and not by her husband, present in the same room. Secondly, the boginka allegedly appeared only in the evening or at night, hence at the time when all kinds of illnesses intensified; finally its influence was directed only towards the mother and her child and not to other members of the family. Ascribed to the boginka was also stealing or exchanging a human child for a changeling (odmieniec), or even causing its death from frustrating vengeance. — Ethnologia Polona, p. 96

• With the exception of this means of getting the real child back (which shows that the boginka is still very much a mythological pagan being), the other means are mainly magical and the same as against the devil — the sign of the cross, Christian amulets, exorcisms. The priest can free the woman from the hands of the boginka, but he must wear all his ceremonial clothes turned wrong side out. — THE POLISH PEASANT IN EUROPE AND AMERICA , p. 238

• BOHYNKA (boginka, divá žena), demonic entity of anthropomorphic appearance, forest spirit with attributes of natural demon. In the obsessions of Orava, Spiš, and especially Zamagurí, the goddess was describing himself as an expressive evil, a ugly creature of a tall, poor figure, not overwhelmed by the hair, with large breasts that swoop over his shoulder. She had long, strapped hair stretching out on her heels and various body errors (she was barking, shrieking). She had grown nervous in her clothes, and she was naked. It inhabited rock and forest holes, hillsides and marshlands. The environment in which the goddess lived and the characterization of its appearance corresponded to the characters represented in the imagination of the Slavs by the demons of nature (in Slovakia known Runa, grgalica, poludnica). In relation to humans, the goddess appeared to be a clearly damaging being, threatening especially the six-eyed. They stole and exchanged their healthy children for their unborn goddesses (transform) that did not grow up, did not speak, and were very careful. — Bohinka. Center for Traditional Folk Culture. (in Slovak)

  --Лобачев Владимир (talk) 02:55, 24 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

• Oppose. See sources. --Лобачев Владимир (talk) 05:42, 25 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

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