Wikipedia:WikiProject Deletion sorting/Ethnic groups

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Ethnic groups

Foundational Black Americans

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Seems to be heavy on Copy Vios, and may well mirror black Amercians. Slatersteven (talk) 17:10, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

There is a bit of a distinction between Black American and the "Foundational Black American" lineage which seems to more attached to a leader, community and quasi-movement along with its ethnic group emphasis. This distinction seems to be elaborated on in the Terminology section about its origins. Fba-warrior (talk) 17:33, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

All of which can be said with "Whilst black American cultural leaders are sometimes called "Foundational Black Americans"". Does it need its own article? Slatersteven (talk) 17:36, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, unfortunately, because there are some black Americans who do not identify as a Foundational Black American and others who do. This is also a fairly new phenomenon that seems to becoming more popular, as many Black Americans do not know of this new "identity". There are some who consider the FBAs to be a movement or a cult. Fba-warrior (talk) 18:37, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

So both

wp:not may come into play here? Slatersteven (talk) 18:40, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply

]

That's my impression. I don't think it's caught on in an academic sense either. Oaktree b (talk) 20:08, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The issue of academic validity has been certified more in the clarity of qualifications of what an FBA is and additionally a statement of "ethnic purpose" later expounded on in the subsections which further deviates from what was mentioned in the African American/Black American wiki pages. While those have been hyper-linked to the FBA page, the Foundational Black American page takes you to a community within a community bio, so to speak. However, labeling it a sub-community is a bit of misnomer. These are the same people with a uniquely different life scope and acknowledged identity. Fba-warrior (talk) 21:43, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete or convert back to redirect Content fork from Tariq Nasheed, which this page used to redirect to. Don't see justification for a separate page. I also removed, as is required, most of the copyright violations and asked for revdel. Did not check rest of article for close paraphrasing or other copyvios — rsjaffe 🗣️ 17:51, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Redirect (
WP:TNT), even if there is a notable topic in there writing it would involve removing basically everything currently there... We seem to have a lot of OR with the reliable sources for the most part not actually discussing the concept... For example the Coates piece does not mention Foundational Black Americans, it says that the enslavement of black Americans is foundational to American history. Horse Eye's Back (talk) 17:55, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply
]
That's my issue, some strange SYNTH going on, when the source talks about in one way and it's being used here in another. Not that this isn't a valid topic for an article, we just don't have enough RS to build upon. Oaktree b (talk) 20:10, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I think the notable concept as it were also largely overlaps with American Descendants of Slavery, I am not an expert in the area though. Horse Eye's Back (talk) 20:35, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Nothing in that article that is properly sourced ties specifically to Foundational Black Americans other than the flag and the term. Even the flag is not sourced, though I expect there to be some acceptable source for it somewhere. — rsjaffe 🗣️ 23:40, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Rsjaffe Regarding the flag, we can't say things such as "Foundational Black Americans usually have a unique flag ..." Where is any evidence for this? How could there be evidence when most people who might meet the definition have almost certainly never heard of the term of the flag. Note that there several websites associated with the term, all of which seem to be selling something. Doug Weller talk 07:19, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The term and flag are both pretty self-explanatory as you have numerous visual of individuals wearing the term and holding the flag at the annual Foundational Black American conferences and rallies. There have been multiple registered events under the branding of this name alias. The online community also shows evidence of some kind of cyber allegiance on twitter/x, youtube, instagram. facebooks, etc. which is typical of some of these groups start in the social media age. Also, this term has been used by other news media outlets, most specifically "African News Diaspora", formerly run MSNBC show Tiffany Cross, and "Unfiltered with Roland Martin." Fba-warrior (talk) 13:28, 17 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Fba-warrior How many FBAs do you think there are? What % have the flage? Doug Weller talk 16:04, 18 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

American Descendants of Slavery is a movement and terminology founded and used by Yvetter Carnell, if I am not mistaken. There is seemingly some overlap due to these people all being from similar histories and lineages but the Foundational Black American identity is a bit more distinct. The differences would be I assume the loyalty of group base to which founder's philosophies and personalities. One being loyal to Tariq Nasheed and his push for reparations through an online campaign and independent political process. The other being an actual grassroots organization that was registered in Chicago I believe and had a meeting building

. Fba-warrior (talk) 13:34, 17 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Theres numerous articles btw on the difference between FBA and ADOS. Heres one for example, maybe this needs to be explained on the fba page

https://dwomowale.medium.com/why-pan-africanism-matters-lessons-from-ados-vs-fba-c643223b5672 Fba-warrior (talk) 14:15, 18 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Medium isn't a reliable source, see
WP:RSNP. That blog in fact says " Tariq decided to use Foundational Black American (FBA) and then began using FBA interchangeably with ADOS, which created a lot of confusion." If that's right, then it doesn't explain the difference except for the agreement between Nasheed and ADOS. Doug Weller talk 16:09, 18 June 2024 (UTC)[reply
]

Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Ethnic groups and United States of America. Spiderone^{(Talk to Spider)} 18:15, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete: Newsone doesn't strike me as a RS, rest are name drops... This can easily be handled in the article about African Americans. I don't see much for sourcing beyond their website. Oaktree b (talk) 20:07, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Oaktree b I took newsone to RSN May last year for its use in the earlier version of this article.[1]. Doug Weller talk 16:16, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Comment: The term is mostly used in regards to Covid 19 and vaccines [2] in the Black population, which is another idea, distinct from this one. There could be an article there, but using these sources here doesn't help. Oaktree b (talk) 20:12, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
This is not a term used by scholars, and a few modern references and usages do not add up to the claim made in the opening sentence. Delete. Drmies (talk) 21:46, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete/Redirect, No precise RS, and this term doesn't seem notable in itself. No need for this to have its own page. — Alien333 (what I did & why I did it wrong) 14:28, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Redirect to Tariq Nasheed#Views and reception and then protect it. Deleting will only result in someone re-creating it, and then we'll be right back here for the third time. - Sumanuil. _{(talk to me)} 07:07, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Keep, its a unique ethnic phenomenon. seems to be transpiring among African Americans. I noticed some of the origins are when they discuss their African heritage, “what allegiance do they have with the US”. more seem to be identifying with the term. The first time I heard it was on Twitter when a black person said “Obama didn’t fight for foundational black Americans because his dad’s from Kenya!” Strange! I thought, what does that have to do with anything??

I decided to look up the term and found “FBA” on urban dictionary with similar definition as the one on this page and I also found this article. apparently this is a huge conversation being had among them, like an ethnogenesis of some sort!

https://www.fashionghana.com/site/fba-foundational-black-americans/ Phil Whidwick (talk) 04:09, 18 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Phil Whidwick This is your first edit which means two things - you found out about this off wiki or by email and you don't know our policies. That website says "FashionGHANA.com; African Fashion Magazine, Blog ..." certainly an unsigned article in a fashion magazine can't be used as a source. And the Urban Dictionary is user generated and not a reliable source any more than WIkipedia is.

So what brought you here? Doug Weller talk 16:27, 18 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

And copious OR. Slatersteven (talk) 14:56, 18 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/2020 May Kado massacre (2nd nomination)

Ethnic groups

Foundational Black Americans

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