Talk:College rock

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The

I added some bands based on [1] and think that this list -- [2] -- may also be useful (but have not yet added any based upon it). Should we add Ramones, for instance? How about Meat Puppets?

I also added two references to the use of this term to refer to 1980s music, and removed the unsourced addition claiming that the term "usually" means something else these days - Foetusized 17:23, 9 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Technically most every alt-rock band during the 80s could be considered college rock, with the exceptions of industrial rock and most goth. It's best to only list the bands most associated with the term (R.E.M., Husker Du, Replacements, and so forth). Ramones definitely don't count. The Last.fm tags are useless since they're user-based and in no way objective. WesleyDodds 21:53, 9 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

For reference, here's the list that was recently removed from the article. Doc Strange^MailboxLogbook 16:11, 30 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Provide a basis for define college rock strictly within a single decade. GenacGenac (talk) 17:29, 26 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Google books link to All music guide to rock: the definitive guide to rock, pop, and soul (print edition): Morrissey entry (see page 1033 for The Smiths entry). The link was too long to put in the comment when I recently restored both to the article, after someone claimed they didn't fit the College Rock aesthetic. -- Foetusized (talk) 14:38, 17 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

This article begins by stating "college rock is a term that was used in the United States to describe 1980s alternative rock before the term 'alternative' came into common usage." However, it appears the term "college rock" came into use concurrently with the term "alternative rock". Can anyone document any usage of the term "college rock", as it is defined in this article, prior to 1989? Piriczki (talk) 17:13, 19 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

A Google News archive search turned up nothing. This article uses a reliable source and I also found several Rolling Stone articles from the 2000s stating that "college rock" was used in the 1980s. Maybe this is one of those selective memory things that just got universally accepted. The College Music Journal/Survey did start in 1981 and the New York Times did start to use "Alternative Rock" in the mid 1980s.

I won't change anything here for now as it does have a reliable third party source but I did put a "citation needed" warning in the alternative rock article and I will create discussion in that articles talk page. That article is a lot more heavily trafficked then this one. Edkollin (talk) 17:07, 13 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]

By my recollection, the terms "college rock" and "alternative rock" were both in use when I was DJing at a student-run college station in the late 1980s. It wasn't that "college rock" was used, and then replaced by "alternative rock"; it was that both were used, but over time, usage of "college rock" dropped, leaving the music to be known as "alternative rock". Perhaps this sentence could be phrased better -- Foetusized (talk) 18:29, 13 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]

If you have material(college newspapers?) from then using the term it would be helpful. Edkollin (talk) 05:54, 16 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I have posted several sources that have stated and prove that Jangle pop is part of college rock. binksternet keeps claiming my posts are wrong when in fact everything I had posted is 100% proof Jangle and college rock are the same. I think a third opinion is needed.--2601:3C5:8200:97E0:5DBB:279A:D261:CD66 (talk) 02:35, 31 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The issue that you have been fighting about is this: Is college rock "conflated with" jangle pop?[3]

The answer is "no", because college rock is much larger than jangle pop, containing more genres. Alternative rock is famously part of college rock, along with other genres such as ska punk, post-punk, experimental rock, indie rock, etc. Jangle pop is a big part of the picture, but not the whole picture.

The sources you have been citing are the following:

• https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-features/college-rock-playlist-1086100 Rolling Stone presents "college rock" songs which include "jangly Eighties classics from R.E.M., Camper Van Beethoven, Pylon, and more." The source says college rock started as dance-punk of Pylon and then was defined by R.E.M.'s "cryptic guitar jangle".
• https://www.allmusic.com/style/college-rock-ma0000012237 AllMusic says that "Early college rock's two most influential groups were R.E.M. and the Smiths, who paved the way for countless practitioners of jangly guitar-pop" such as the dB's, Let's Active, the Housemartins, and the La's.
• https://www.popmatters.com/180466-spindizzy-jangle-the-reivers-in-your-eyes-2495671650.html PopMatters says "At the time the song was released [1987], the music scene was experiencing a groundswell of what were called 'college rock', or sometimes 'jangle pop', bands."

None of these sources are explicitly saying that college rock is conflated with jangle pop. None are saying that college rock is also called jangle pop. They are describing a situation in which jangly guitar sounds may be part of the college rock sound, but they don't say that the two terms are conflated.

If we are going to tell the reader that two musical genres are conflated with each other, we should have very strong sourcing from musicologists. Nothing like that is found in these sources. Binksternet (talk) 06:22, 31 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Ska punk has nothing to do with college rock. You are confusing that with Modern Rock. I find it funny you immediately ran off and accused me of vandalism when you could have brought this to the talk page. I see you can read the "cryptic guitar jangle" part now go ahead and type jangle into the search bar and tell me what comes up. To anyone reading this type jangle into the search bar and tell me what comes up. we can also do a support or oppose vote right now if you want.--2601:3C5:8200:97E0:B80E:9C52:6A32:B1BC (talk) 07:07, 31 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

You are misrepresenting your sources and thereby undercutting your argument. Just because something is described as having a "jangly" sound it does not mean that the author considers that music to be part of the jangle pop or jangle rock or jangle anything-else genres. You are violating one of the

synthesizing sources to make them appear to support a position that none of them actually take because that's what you want them to say and not because that's what they actually say. Please stop genre-warring on this issue. If you can find a source that says "Jangle pop included college rock" or something very similar you might have an argument but you don't. Eggishorn (talk) (contrib) 22:56, 31 December 2020 (UTC)[reply

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Trying to end a dispute isnt genre warring at all. and from what you wrote you seem to be picking

favorites It takes two to edit war, and I haven't reverted it back so I am no longer edit warring. Why not offer a compromise? Instead of saying I can never be right, no matter what source I use.--2601:3C5:8200:97E0:BC5B:16FC:CCD7:E67B (talk) 09:42, 4 January 2021 (UTC)[reply

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To repeat myself: If you can find a source that says "Jangle pop included college rock" or something very similar you might have an argument... I explicitly gave you the method by which you can show that you are right. It is up to you to look for that. And, just for the record, "trying to end a dispute" by repeatedly making the same change to an article is edit warring. As to "offering a compromise", any compromise position that fails to follow the

Core Content Policies is an unacceptable Argument to moderation. Eggishorn (talk) (contrib) 16:34, 4 January 2021 (UTC)[reply

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The original issue I had was that jangle pop on Chronic Town linked to an article that doesn't have an infobox. If jangle pop is gonna be used as a genre it needs to have its own infobox, otherwise we use college rock because it is sourced. Thats my compromise to you. Now let me hear yours.--2601:3C5:8200:97E0:6911:8E20:6E63:E0C0 (talk) 07:15, 5 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

You have no understanding of how this site works, do you? We don't offer positions based on our understanding of terms as you seem determined to do. We follow sources and you have yet to provide any that support your malleable positions. Please read, understand, and follow the

Original Research. Eggishorn (talk) (contrib) 18:07, 5 January 2021 (UTC)[reply

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I take

offense to what you wrote. I have been using this site on and off for over 10+ years and there is no need to be a dickhead towards me. You just wanna argue is all you wanna do. You didn't even bring up my infobox comment, I am done with this site and done talking to you. goodbye--2601:3C5:8200:97E0:39FC:7910:D397:D3C4 (talk) 18:49, 5 January 2021 (UTC)[reply

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I have no obligation to address every point you wish me to address nor did I ever make anything even approaching a personal attack. I am not responsible for your feelings. If you're done with this entire site after being asked to follow sourcing rules on a simple musical genre question, then

there's some introspection in order. Eggishorn (talk) (contrib) 18:54, 5 January 2021 (UTC)[reply

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The quote from the New Republic regarding "tens of thousands of kilowatts" is obviously a misprint (i.e., the original article is a misprint). What is the acceptable way to indicate that mistake in the Wikipedia quote? Tedd (talk) 04:58, 22 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]