Talk:Pierre-Charles Villeneuve

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I don't understand Gdr's 7/26/05 revert at all. The Battle of ... is normally capitalized. I confirmed it by looking at several articles such as Waterloo, Battle of Agincourt, etc. Similarly, Naval Minister makes more sense in English than Minister of Marine. Art LaPella 22:38, July 26, 2005 (UTC)

"Minster of Marine" is the correct term to use for France. And the second occurrence is a direct quote from the 1911 Encyclopedia Britannica. [1]. Leave the term alone, or gloss it if it's unclear. Gdr 23:20, 26 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

You're right! At least about the direct quote. Art LaPella 23:45, July 26, 2005 (UTC)

Why is he listed in cathegories Murdered Millitary Personell and Millitary personell who committed suicide? 62.16.246.235 (talk) —Preceding undated comment was added at 11:23, 3 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

This article was automatically assessed because at least one article was rated and this bot brought all the other ratings up to at least that level. BetacommandBot 07:51, 27 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

It is very difficult to commit suicide by stabbing oneself six times. Though his death was officially ruled a suicide, is there a reasonable suspicion that he was murdered? Werdnawerdna (talk) 11:37, 22 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I am thinking of a bit from the novel Cetaganda by Lois McMaster Bujold:

“It was suicide, wasn't it?"

"In an involuntary sort of way," said Vorob'yev. "These Cetagandan political suicides can get awfully messy, when the principal won't cooperate."

"Thirty-two stab wounds in the back, worst case of suicide they ever saw?" murmured Ivan, clearly fascinated by the gossip.

"Exactly, my lord.”

Removed the reference to the six stabs wounds as the only source I have found that agrees with this is the questionable memoirs of a Sargeant. Walter Scott etc seem to accept that he commited suicide rather than face the charges of cowardice although it was widely rumoured at the time that he had been murdered. 86.137.177.80 (talk) —Preceding undated comment was added at 19:12, 26 November 2008 (UTC).[reply]

Somebody put the reference to the six stab wounds again! I researched it a bit. The reference 1 "Pierre-Charles Villeneuve (1763-1806" [2] which is in fact a transcription of the 1911 Encyclopædia Britannica, doubts the hypothesis of suicide. A useful reference may be an article by A.V. (probably Abel-François_Villemain in La Revue Française, New York Edition, Volume Quatrième, 1835, p. 77 [3] but I do not know how reliable it is. It says (as other references I have seen) that the police report mentions six stab wounds but also that the door was locked and other facts that support the suicide theory. Zaleski (talk) 14:01, 21 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Removed "He was buried without ceremony": this contradicts the Villemain account above [4] and there are no contrary references to support it. Removed also "He has been considered a tragic figure caught in a critical position of authority or an agent of the British, or at least an agent of anti-Napoleonic France", again there are no references. Removed "suspiciously" and "strangely" which to me seem a no-neutral point of view. Zaleski (talk) 16:03, 21 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Why is the particule *de* omitted in English article??? Frania W. (talk) 02:50, 22 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

It is odd someone made so many mistakes however being a career officer with distinguished service. And that the British released him and were interested in allowing him safe return to France seems suspicious. Denial from British sources of him being an agent of theirs, will never surface as it would demerit the Victory over France's fleet as a sold out deal less heroic, hunting a game prize roped or stringed by its master. The murder of Villeneuve, would have served well Napoleon's interests too as a tragic figure of cowardice but also to cover such shameful admission of military weakness having staff passing to the service of the enemy. The need of trial not needed as Napoleon agents in England must have already caught on evidence against the Admiral in his game truncating the plans of French invasion. England was full of his old aristocratic peers dissidents against Napoleon's Imperial establishment. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.210.242.252 (talk) 21:30, 15 January 2016 (UTC)[reply]

The British sent Villeneuve to England on the Euryalus but released him on parole; during this time he lived in Bishop's Waltham in Hampshire. He stayed at the Crown Inn public house and his men, who numbered 200, stayed in local houses. He was allowed to attend the funeral of Lord Nelson at Bishop's Waltham.

I was under the impression Lord Nelson's funeral was at St. Paul's. Claverhouse (talk) 01:52, 11 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

It was - and it was in 1806, after this article claims Villeneuve returned to France. I've restored the word "whilst" to the sentence about him attending, which makes the sentence make more sense. I think I've read elsewhere that V did not in fact return to France until early 1806, which would have given him the time to go, but we need some more sourcing for that section. DuncanHill (talk) 03:24, 21 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

You mean " Propaganda " ... right ??? Or your claim the British press of the time is " Propaganda "

Original phrase ""The nature of his death ensured that this verdict was much mocked in the British press of the time and suspicions abounded that Napoleon had secretly ordered Villeneuve's murder . "

I recomand to replace " British press " by anti-French propaganda or Wartime propaganda . The first one is more historically accurate as the British press remained anti-french even at peace .

Reggard

Crazy_Defender_2 2A01:CB00:456:9C00:AC61:B0D8:87A:3515 (talk) 10:38, 12 January 2024 (UTC)[reply]