User talk:Grangehilllover

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Hello,

Just a random message to say thank you for your great contributions to my Sam Retford article - you made it look much better! It’s my first ever article, I’m a bit of a newbie, so I appreciate it!

It's fine: you'll pick it up along the way. I'll see about adding more to it, but just a tip: you may get the temptation to create articles, but before that, you have to make sure they are notable and reliable sources to back it up. And you can always test stuff out in your sandbox. Grangehilllover (talk) 22:46, 20 November 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks Joesimnett (talk) 22:26, 20 November 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Hi, I think it's potentially misleading if list a family like Carter for Whitney without saying it's by marriage as it looks like it's through being born into that family. I'm not suggesting adding it for adoptions, and for Sharon there would be no qualifier as she is adopted into the Watts family. I often see families added and I think "she's not in that family" but then I realise it's because they married into it. But Laura Beale's family tree isn't in the Beale tree, it doesn't show anyone she is related to by blood other than her son, who is already listed in her infobox. The family link was actually added to link to a family article with a family tree that shows the rest of that person's relatives. But for Whitney, linking to the Carters doesn't show any of her relatives. So actually I'd be more in favour of removing the family link if it's only through marriage. Also, I think a message is better than an edit summary :-) — ᴀnemoneᴘroᴊecтors 22:50, 30 November 2018 (UTC)[reply]

@AnemoneProjectors: Fair enough. I was wondering after seeing your edit summary on Ian Beale's page about his wives surnames: I think we should adopt common name for it. For Jane, hands down, she is known as Jane Beale where as Mel is more known as Owen, even now (mainly because she's credited by it), but I don't think I've seen it been her referred in media as Mel Beale. Plus, we adopt common name for the pages themselves because they are better known because it gets so confusing with name changes. It's kind of backtracking on ourselves if we say "No, Stacey's common name is Stacey Slater, so the page stays as Stacey Slater" then "No, Stacey is Fowler because she's married to Martin." Grangehilllover (talk) 17:17, 2 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

The thing that annoys me most is seeing character names constantly being changed in infobox family sections. Sometimes it's "current" name, sometimes it's article name, sometimes it's most-relevant-to-the-character-in-question name (can't think of any examples right now!). But it's definitely time we sorted it out, and I think we should go with commonname in these sections, and yes it would mean saying, for example, that Dennis (Jnr)'s mother is Sharon Watts when has never been Sharon Watts while Dennis has been around, but it's actually not to do with the name but the character - Sharon Watts, Sharon Rickman and Sharon Mitchell are all the same character. So yes, common name is my thinking. I'd be interested to hear what others think about this.... @JuneGloom07, Soaper1234, Raintheone, and 5 albert square:? — ᴀnemoneᴘroᴊecтors 17:45, 2 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I think the simplest solution would be the common name. Soaper1234 - talk 17:55, 2 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I'm leaning towards common name too. - JuneGloom07 Talk 20:38, 2 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I think common name too.-- 5 albert square (talk) 22:52, 2 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Woo. This maybe wasn't the best place to discuss it but oh well :-) — ᴀnemoneᴘroᴊecтors 23:05, 2 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

@AnemoneProjectors: It's fine. Grangehilllover (talk) 23:56, 2 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I know, I mean if we call this consensus other editors might think we're sneaky for doing it outside of the article talkspace. — ᴀnemoneᴘroᴊecтors 07:27, 3 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Well, say we implement this now and other editors have problems with it, I'll link this discussion and if they have a problem with it being on my talkpage, then restart the conversation on the page. It's normally really hard to get others to put their opinion. Grangehilllover (talk) 08:57, 3 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I agree... — ᴀnemoneᴘroᴊecтors 10:17, 3 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

So, would it be OK to change things from now? Grangehilllover (talk) 11:48, 3 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Yes :-) — ᴀnemoneᴘroᴊecтors 22:04, 3 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Whilst we're on the subject of common names, do you think Rebecca should change to Bex Fowler in heading and stuff? Bex was adopted for Bex 4 years now is it? She was Chloe in 2000/2001 and Rebecca in 2002, 2005-2007 and part of 2014? And is Lily more notable as Fowler or Branning: she was a baby in 2010 as Lily Branning, came back as Lily Branning for 2014-2016 and Lily Fowler since 2016? Grangehilllover (talk) 22:11, 3 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I think that Bex should be Bex Fowler now and I'm unsure about Lily since she is still a child - leaning more towards Fowler though... Soaper1234 - talk 22:22, 3 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Because Lily has had nothing to do with the Brannings, with or without the surname Branning, apart from Whitney and Tiffany as Bianca's kids. She's practically Martin's daughter, the same as Bex and Hope. Grangehilllover (talk) 22:48, 3 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I'd happily go with Bex Fowler and Lily Fowler. We used to use Google News to see what had the most results but Google News is shit not the same as it once was, so I don't know how we can check. — ᴀnemoneᴘroᴊecтors 11:54, 5 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Normal Google (not news) shows 71k results for "bex fowler" eastenders -wiki and 12k for "rebecca fowler" eastenders -wiki. Lily Fowler and Lily Branning are about equal. . — ᴀnemoneᴘroᴊecтors 13:28, 5 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Hope you had a good Christmas/holiday/etc. As we've changed Bex and Lily, how about changing William Mitchell to Will Mitchell? — 🌼📽️AnemoneProjectors💬 15:24, 26 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, I'd go for Will Mitchell. Grangehilllover (talk) 16:31, 26 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

@AnemoneProjectors: I was looking back on a conversation regarding guardians/wards. Bex's adopted grandmother, Margaret Wilson, was her guardian following the death of her adoptive mum and dad, Sue and Neil. What do we do in this case? Legally, Margaret is/was Bex's grandparent the same as Pauline. Grangehilllover (talk) 21:06, 26 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know! It's all getting too much for me! lol — 🌼📽️AnemoneProjectors💬 21:10, 26 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

@AnemoneProjectors: I do have an idea once I learn how to do it. I looked at the EE 1997 Ireland episode pages and the family tree, which is collapsible. If by any chance I get my head round it, maybe we could ditch the family section in the infobox and have a family tree? Grangehilllover (talk) 23:57, 26 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

The Flaherty family tree is pretty simple. User:DBD has several EastEnders family trees at User:DBD/EE (I hope he doesn't mind my sharing this) and if you have a look at some of them, they are very complicated. I think the way we do the family trees in the other family pages is easier to follow. But we can ditch the families in the infobox anyway - it's really meant to include a sub-box, like in Ferreira family, where the individual characters don't have an infobox. — 🌼📽️AnemoneProjectors💬 11:49, 27 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

They are good. Well, if we ask the user, how about then doing away with family trees and simply put in family trees at the bottom of the page under a new section on each page "Family" and make them collapsible so they don't take up so much room? Grangehilllover (talk) 14:23, 27 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I'd be against it because look how complicated the Mitchell tree is compared to what we have, and how much space it takes up. Yes the collapsible option is there, but as it is, I think it's easier to understand and I don't think it should be collapsed because the family link in the character infobox brings you to an article with a list of other family members showing how they are related. If you are curious to the someone's other relatives that aren't in the infobox, it's easy to find. We should stick with {{Tree list}} for the larger families - Branning, Beale, Mitchell, Slater, Carter. Even the Watts family is complicated due to Sharon's adoption and marrying her adoptive brother so best leave that as well. — 🌼📽️AnemoneProjectors💬 15:01, 27 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Though I'm gratified someone's noticed and appreciated the charts I keep, they aren't really intended for the purpose mooted. As noted, several of them are rather too complex for use in an article. Personally, I would favour conveying the information in a format where the members without any proper relationship to the family can be noted. Whit and Halfway are de facto Carters and Patrick a de facto Fox-Hubbard, but there is no official relationship no note in either case. DBD 19:02, 30 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks, I do enjoy your trees but I agree that they aren't ideal for articles - it's your own project. You make a good point though. In the Carters' article, under the family chart, Babe and Elaine are mentioned, but Halfway could also be mentioned (Whitney was married to Lee so she's in the tree). In fiction, it's not always about how people are related through blood, but how they fit together as a unit. I find Whitney hard to place at the moment, I'd put her and Tiffany together as the only current Jacksons. While we're on the subject of families, I thought I'd mention that there are plans for a list of families with all the trees in that Soaper1234 and I are currently working on (and others were in the past that have since left Wikipedia) and it uses the same {{Tree list}} format. Also I don't think the Flaherty tree should be collapsed anyway. — 🌼📽️AnemoneProjectors💬 19:29, 30 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year! Thanks for all your help this year and all the best for 2019. Soaper1234 - talk 12:35, 27 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

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List of AB characters

Hey! Sorry if the edits I just did on

talk) 20:45, 12 February 2019 (UTC)[reply

]

Hi @

DarkGlow

:

Just for a few minutes, can you not edit the page please? Just so I don't loose something I'm doing to make things easier. And then once I've done, I'll show you. Grangehilllover (talk) 20:49, 12 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

I was editing the page as you sent that, so sorry! Just saw this message, I’ll stop now. (I’m done now) –

talk) 20:51, 12 February 2019 (UTC)[reply

]

Thanks! Grangehilllover (talk) 20:53, 12 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@

List of Ackley Bridge characters. Like I said, they're all characters, but you made some good points. I think I'm missing a couple that I'll add in a bit. Grangehilllover (talk) 21:52, 12 February 2019 (UTC)[reply

]

Just an update on this conversation: a few weeks ago, I completely changed the format on the article and forgot to leave a message on your talk page. I don't want it to seem like I was trying to undo the work you'd put into the article! I decided to reformat the article because another user had started making incomplete changes to the article that made it confusing, so I decided it'd be easier to change the format - I hope that's okay! –

talk) 14:17, 19 May 2019 (UTC)[reply

]

Hi @

DarkGlow

: I've been taking some time out but I'm starting up again. The table is fine, but I am going to restore this hidden comment:

Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style/Television#Cast_and_characters_information on lists states "cast listing should be ordered according to the original broadcast credits, with new cast members being added to the end of the list [...] articles should reflect the entire history of a series, and as such actors remain on the list even after their departure from the series [...] "main" cast members are determined by the series producers (not by popularity, screen time, or episode count) and generally have a set order in the credits, recurring and guest stars will not necessarily be credited in the same order in each episode in which they appear, so their place in the list should be based on the order of credits in the first episode that they appear."

Because last year when I edited it, some user decided to put the cast in their chosen order instead of sticking with the way it should have been done. Grangehilllover (talk) 16:00, 19 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Another query for you; on the character list page, Jack Murgatroyd is listed as present for series 1–3, but

talk) 22:30, 19 June 2019 (UTC)[reply

]

Hi, I'll check definite later, but I do believe the 2 Murgatroyd lads were in series 2. But like I said, I will check. Grangehilllover (talk) 12:17, 20 June 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Have you seen this? Looks like Missy is making a comeback, in terms of flashbacks scenes! –

talk) 20:23, 3 July 2019 (UTC)[reply

]

Liz White

Hi again! Regarding Liz White: the Forge's Ackley page (https://theforgeentertainment.co.uk/production/ackley-bridge/) lists the senior main cast members. For the first two series, Liz White was on it, but she's been dropped from it in the series 3 section. The same happened to Adil Ray (who isn't in the main cast anymore) and Paul Nicholls (who has left the show). Thus, I believe that - coupled with the line from the trailer - provides sufficient evidence to safely assume she's not gonna be in the main cast. And as we don't know how many episode she'll be in (though by the trailer, and other info, it looks like just one), I think that guest status would be more appropriate than recurring. Thanks. --Executiveop (talk) 19:05, 14 June 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Hi @Executiveop: I get that The Forge is the production company and I get that some of the main cast is listed, but there lies the problem...it is only some. Admittedly the likes of Friar, Hickman, Sarker, Joyner and Nicholls are established actors amongst the main cast, but there is also more newer and rising actors amongst the main cast (Retford, Ryan, Deacon). I'm not disagreeing that Emma could be just recurring or guest, but it's just that one line...and who is to say she won't be a main character in the capacity of a parent? I really think the episode should air for us to make that decision and if she does make 1 or 2 episodes, then the change can happen. Grangehilllover (talk) 19:15, 14 June 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Fair enough --Executiveop (talk) 19:18, 14 June 2019 (UTC)[reply]

@Executiveop: But like I say, if the change is right, then there's no reason not to update and there will be no problem. Grangehilllover (talk) 19:21, 14 June 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Ackley Bridge

Hey! Do you happen to know the director and writer for Episode 6? Also, a user just added ratings for Episode 4 with a poorly formatted source, yet when I checked the source, I can't find the 1.15m listed there. Are you seeing the same thing? –

talk) 20:38, 23 July 2019 (UTC)[reply

]

@

DarkGlow: In a bit of a rush, I didn't pay attention to the titles, so I'll check later today. If something doesn't match to a source, it's probably someone making it up or something. Grangehilllover (talk) 02:07, 24 July 2019 (UTC)[reply

]

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Sophie Webster

Please stop incorrectly editing Sophie Webster's page to portray her as a current character. The character is long gone. No maternity leave lasts for two years, most only last for eight months. When she returns you can add her back but for now your edits are misleading. Connorguy99 (talk) 22:22, 24 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Connorguy99: Brooke's had another baby, so it's going to be extended. Maternity leave for one baby isn't for the second. Why don't you find a source saying she has definitely left? Because she hasn't. Grangehilllover (talk) 11:31, 25 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

@Grangehilllover: Just like Ian Beale on the EastEnders page, while Sophie may not be gone for good she has been off-screen for too long and is not set to return in the near future therefore it is completely incorrect to list her as a current character. By your logic we should also consider Emily Bishop and Rosie Webster as current characters because neither "officially" left... absolutely ridiculous. Connorguy99 (talk) 11:50, 25 June 2021 (UTC)[reply]

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Scarlett Thomas (actress) moved to draftspace

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Your draft article, Draft:Scarlett Thomas (actress)

Hello, Grangehilllover. It has been over six months since you last edited the

Articles for Creation submission or Draft page you started, "Scarlett Thomas

".

In accordance with our policy that Wikipedia is not for the indefinite hosting of material deemed unsuitable for the encyclopedia

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Thanks for your submission to Wikipedia, and happy editing. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 07:34, 22 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

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1. ^ https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/tracybeaker/images/a/af/Screenshot_2018-07-08_at_19.27.09.png/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/400?cb=20180708183004