Wikipedia:Files for discussion/2016 November 9

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November 9

File:Ma Ji 馬季马季.jpg

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The result of the discussion was: Delete; deleted by Explicit (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT ⚡ 06:05, 15 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

A common file

WP:NFCC. Shwangtianyuan Talk Here 04:13, 9 November 2016 (UTC)[reply

]

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File:Mirko Cro Cop vs Wanderlei Silva.gif

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The result of the discussion was: Delete; deleted by Explicit (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT ⚡ 06:05, 15 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Animated GIF that was clearly created from a video. Uploader is unlikely to be the copyright holder of the original video which is the source for the GIF. Whpq (talk) 04:24, 9 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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File:Writer-Director Andres Useche & actress Jennifer Aniston.jpg

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Unused, no encyclopedic use FASTILY 08:21, 9 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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File:CampusCenter.JPG

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The result of the discussion was: Delete; deleted by Explicit (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT ⚡ 06:05, 15 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Possible copyvio - EXIF attributes 'rick smith' and file description page contains {{Cc-by|Copyright Kettering University}} FASTILY 08:29, 9 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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File:Spectral temporal tuning grey.jpg

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The result of the discussion was: Delete ~ Rob₁₃^Talk 18:55, 30 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Unused, no encyclopedic use FASTILY 08:32, 9 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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File:KettCrashLab.jpg

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The result of the discussion was: Delete; deleted by Explicit (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT ⚡ 06:05, 15 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Possible copyvio - EXIF attributes 'rick smith' and file description page contains {{Cc-by|Copyright Kettering University}} FASTILY 08:39, 9 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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File:Montepittman micheleambra2.jpg

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The result of the discussion was: Delete; deleted by Explicit (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT ⚡ 06:05, 15 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Promotional image/poster, dubious self-work claim FASTILY 08:43, 9 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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File:Seema Midha 001.jpg

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The result of the discussion was: Delete ~ Rob₁₃^Talk 18:55, 30 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Unused, no encyclopedic use FASTILY 08:45, 9 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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File:KettLEGO.jpg

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The result of the discussion was: Delete; deleted by Explicit (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT ⚡ 06:05, 15 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Possible copyvio - EXIF attributes 'rick smith' and file description page contains {{Cc-by|Copyright Kettering University}} FASTILY 08:45, 9 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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File:KettBellTower.jpg

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Possible copyvio - EXIF attributes 'rick smith' and file description page contains {{Cc-by|Copyright Kettering University}} FASTILY 08:46, 9 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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File:Norriscrop.jpg

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The result of the discussion was: Delete; deleted by Explicit (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT ⚡ 06:05, 15 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

unused low-res crop of File:Norrishuckabee.JPG; no encyclopedic use FASTILY 08:46, 9 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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File:KetteringAtwood.JPG

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The result of the discussion was: Delete; deleted by Explicit (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT ⚡ 06:05, 15 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Possible copyvio - EXIF attributes 'rick smith' and file description page contains {{Cc-by|Copyright Kettering University}} FASTILY 08:49, 9 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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File:Paddle Steamer Preservation Society logo.png

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The result of the discussion was: convert to fair use. — ξ ^xplicit 04:51, 15 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Possible derivative of non-free content (logo) FASTILY 08:55, 9 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Appears to be a direct copy of the logo found on the organisations website (http://www.paddlesteamers.org/). Suggest changing the licensing to "non-free logo" and adding a fair use. Salavat (talk) 07:49, 12 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

This is indeed a direct copy of the logo found on the Paddle Steamer Preservation Society website (http://www.paddlesteamers.org/). I am designer and webmaster for this website. I am happy to add a fair use once I figure out how to do this! Mistyisle

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File:Cookeville, TN Train Depot Museum.jpg

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The result of the discussion was: Delete; deleted by Explicit (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT ⚡ 06:05, 15 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Unused, near duplicate of File:Cookeville-depot-museum-tn2.jpg FASTILY 08:56, 9 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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File:KetteringObama.JPG

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Possible copyvio - EXIF attributes 'rick smith' and file description page contains {{Cc-by|Copyright Kettering University}} FASTILY 08:57, 9 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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File:De Apostle 1.jpg

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The result of the discussion was: Delete; deleted by Explicit (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT ⚡ 06:05, 15 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Promotional image, dubious self-work claim FASTILY 08:59, 9 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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File:KettPhysics.jpg

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Possible copyvio - EXIF attributes 'rick smith' and file description page contains {{Cc-by|Copyright Kettering University}} FASTILY 09:00, 9 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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File:KettBara.jpg

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Possible copyvio - EXIF attributes 'rick smith' and file description page contains {{Cc-by|Copyright Kettering University}} FASTILY 09:01, 9 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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File:KettFormula.jpg

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The result of the discussion was: Delete; deleted by Explicit (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT ⚡ 06:05, 15 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Possible copyvio - EXIF attributes 'rick smith' and file description page contains {{Cc-by|Copyright Kettering University}} FASTILY 09:01, 9 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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File:KettFIRST.jpg

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Possible copyvio - EXIF attributes 'rick smith' and file description page contains {{Cc-by|Copyright Kettering University}} FASTILY 09:01, 9 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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File:KetteringCrashCenter.jpg

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The result of the discussion was: Delete; deleted by Explicit (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT ⚡ 06:05, 15 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Unused, no encyclopedic use FASTILY 09:02, 9 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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File:KetteringLegoLab.jpg

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Unused, no encyclopedic use FASTILY 09:02, 9 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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File:KetteringMuseum.JPG

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Possible copyvio - EXIF attributes 'rick smith' and file description page contains {{Cc-by|Copyright Kettering University}} FASTILY 09:02, 9 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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File:Lister Technologies Logo.png

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The result of the discussion was: Delete; deleted by Explicit (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT ⚡ 06:05, 15 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Unused, no encyclopedic use FASTILY 09:39, 9 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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File:Syncthing Logo.png

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The result of the discussion was: Delete; deleted by Explicit (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) AnomieBOT ⚡ 06:05, 15 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Unused, no encyclopedic use FASTILY 09:40, 9 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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File:Praying Shell by Anthony Padgett.JPG

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The result of the discussion was: Delete; deleted as

F8 by Magog the Ogre (talk · contribs · blocks · protections · deletions · page moves · rights · RfA) A file with this name on Commons is now visible. AnomieBOT ⚡ 05:01, 25 November 2016 (UTC)[reply

]

Possible derivative of non-free content (statue) FASTILY 09:40, 9 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Keep - The sculpture is a public sculpture located in the UK where there is FOP for 3D objects. -- John of Reading (talk) 20:35, 9 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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She's Got a Way

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The result of the discussion was: delete the 1972 cover, keep the other ~ Rob₁₃^Talk 23:46, 12 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Two front covers are included to identify the releases of this song. The images are not substantially discussed by sources, so one of images must be kept instead for identification. The 1980s live re-release is more prominent than the original (~~Dutch~~ French) 1972 release. The original 1970s release was uncharted; the live re-recording was charted, however. In short, the 1980s live picture sleeve should be retained; the Dutch one, deleted. George Ho (talk) 23:20, 25 September 2016 (UTC); edited, 09:41, 2 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

The song was released in two substantially different versions. Each of the versions is discussed substantially in the article. So each of the single covers is appropriate for identication. Rlendog (talk) 14:12, 26 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Nevertheless, Rlendog, one release is more prominent than the other. Both versions might have equal prominence, but the live re-release made the original recording more popular than the original release did. Also, the (original) single was neither charted despite overseas release nor commercially released in the US. That's what happened to I Will Remember You (Sarah McLachlan song). George Ho (talk) 16:09, 26 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

If the wrong decision was made in

WP:OTHERSTUFF. Rlendog (talk) 16:12, 26 September 2016 (UTC)[reply

]

Would you contact Jo-Jo Eumerus, who deleted the image? George Ho (talk) 16:28, 26 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know, Rlendog. The consensus agreed in other venues to normally keep just one front cover of any release by the similar singer. George Ho (talk) 16:32, 26 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

That consensus was based on a single editor besides the nominator agreeing that it made sense to have only one of the covers shown. Hardly a broad-based consensus that can be simply applied to all other situations where there are covers to multiple versions that are discussed in the articles. 20:30, 26 September 2016 (UTC)

Here's another proof, Rlendog: this general matter was discussed. Consensus agreed to normally retain one cover unless sources discuss the secondary cover. --George Ho (talk) 20:58, 26 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Just so to be clear,

WP:NFCC#3 says Multiple items of non-free content are not used if one item can convey equivalent significant information. which does not include situations where one item is not enough. The other discussion had nobody strongly defending having two items, if someone can argue that both files here independently contribute to the understanding of the topic and losing one would reduce said understanding, this image can be kept. Jo-Jo Eumerus (talk, contributions) 16:05, 3 October 2016 (UTC)[reply

]

Just to clarify my comment about "I Will Remember You," I don't think the closing admin erred in judging consensus of that FfD, just that these FfDs tend to be lightly attended and so the consensus in a particular one does not necessarily reflect overall Wikipedia consensus. That even happens in some AfDs. As for the Village Pump discussion linked above, that does not address the issue at hand here, where there are multiple recordings, each of which is potentially notable on their own, and each of which is discussed in the article, and so it is legitimate under

WP:NFCC#3

to have a file identifying each of them. 18:09, 17 October 2016 (UTC)~

Multiple releases of the same song, including different recordings, by the same singer do not justify displaying different front covers. This is no exception unless an additional or original release by the same singer is proven significant enough to allow the front cover display. Without prove that the original release was charted, the 1972 (~~Dutch~~ French) image must be deleted. Id est having one image removed does not affect the readers' understanding of the song per

WP:NFCC#8. The topic of the article is not either separate release by the same singer; the article discusses the song and the making of the song and the release(s) of the song. If one of the images is of a different singer's release, we could have kept it. George Ho (talk) 02:09, 18 October 2016 (UTC); edited, 10:14, 2 January 2017 (UTC)[reply

]

As you said, the article discusses the releases of the song. And so the separate releases that are discussed are illustrated for identification purposes. Consistent with our guidelines. Nothing in

WP:NFCC#8

excludes different versions from the same artist, or treats such versions any differently than different versions by different singers. 22:21, 23 October 2016 (UTC)

Per rule #1.2 of

MOS:MUSIC#Images and notation, non-free front covers cannot be used in Wikipedia just for display. The phrase "identification purposes" is equivalent to "purely for decoration". In other words, using an extra image to identify a different release is against the MOS guideline. Unless I'm proven wrong, ignoring this rule does not improve Wikipedia, and the rule is not a prevention from improving Wikipedia. In other words, unless I'm wrong, having an extra image for a mere identification and nothing else is not an improvement for Wikipedia. Regarding "contextual significance" (NFCC#8), the current text of the article adequately helps readers understand the song and its releases without the help of an extra image. George Ho (talk) 00:55, 24 October 2016 (UTC)[reply

]

Identification is not the same as decoration.

WP:NFC provides as an acceptable fair use " Cover art from various items, for visual identification only in the context of critical commentary of that item (not for identification without critical commentary)" [emphasis added]. The article contains critical commentary on both versions that are identified via cover art. Rlendog (talk) 21:04, 25 October 2016 (UTC)[reply

]

How would removing the 1972 ~~Dutch~~ French cover affect readers' grasp of the article's topic, the song? A reader can acknowledge the song's existence without the ~~Dutch~~ French image, and general readers might be fine without it. If readers want to seek a gallery of images, they should go elsewhere per

WP:NOTIMAGE. I made a test edit in my sandbox. George Ho (talk) 03:55, 26 October 2016 (UTC); edited, 10:14, 2 January 2017 (UTC)[reply

]

The single cover identifies the song that is being discussed. This is not a gallery, it is an image in conformance with our guidelines and policies. 00:13, 30 October 2016 (UTC)

Is the significance of the original release greater than the live recording release? I don't see it. The original (overseas) release was not listed in music charts. The live release did. How would this not affect the usage of the images? George Ho (talk) 02:23, 30 October 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Only because you believe only one image may be used. If that is the case then the live recording probably is more significant given its chart position (on the other hand the original recording has a certain significance as the first single release of what became a rather important artist). But since there is nothing to prevent both images from being used there is no need to debate which is more significant. Because both are appropriate to the article. Rlendog (talk) 00:29, 6 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

I'm still not convinced, Rlendog, why readers would not understand the song, "She's Got a Way", without the ~~Dutch~~ French cover art when there is already the live rerelease. Sounds to me that an audio clip should have been uploaded rather than an extra image. The article discusses the song structure, indicating a possible need for an audio clip, not an extra image. Also, the single release of the original version was mentioned in just one sentence. I could not find sources that verify the sales of the original single release. How would words be not enough to help readers understand what the article says without ~~images~~ the ~~Dutch~~ French image? The readers would recognize the significance of the live rerelease if it's the sole image in the article --George Ho (talk) 04:15, 7 November 2016 (UTC); edited, 10:14, 2 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

If I can't convince you, then I must convince instead whoever will close this discussion. George Ho (talk) 04:20, 7 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Deryck C. 15:39, 9 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Keep Live cover (ShesGotAWay.jpg), delete the other. No contextual significance for keeping second cover. First image sufficiently identifies the subject. czar 03:26, 28 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

When you said "subject",

Czar, did you mean the song, the single release, or the artist? Regardless, the live single was better charted, while the single release of the original studio recording either didn't fare well or was uncharted. And how should this case be different from Wikipedia:Files for discussion/2016 June 11#File:Sarah McLachlan - I Will Remember You.jpg? To closer: I didn't realize the 1972 image was French, not the Dutch one (different from the other); I amended that part on the rationale and the album. George Ho (talk) 09:41, 2 January 2017 (UTC)[reply

]

By subject, I mean "She's Got a Way"—the single. I think you can use your discretion in which one to remove. I don't know whether the 1972 didn't chart or whether it just isn't in the article. We typically use the original release artwork unless some later artwork had some prominence as to supersede it. If the Live release was that much more prominent, keep that one and delete the other. czar 19:03, 2 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I tried finding music charts for the original,

Czar. I don't see it in Billboard or any other chart. --George Ho (talk) 21:29, 2 January 2017 (UTC)[reply

]

Yep so fine to keep the Live cover and delete the 1972 then czar 23:11, 2 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the media's
talk page or in a deletion review
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File:Skyler Day 2016.jpg

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the media below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the media's
talk page or in a deletion review
). No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the discussion was: Relisted on Wikipedia:Files for discussion/2016 December 24#File:Skyler_Day_2016.jpg}}

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the media's
talk page or in a deletion review
). No further edits should be made to this section.