Talk:Craig Cobb
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A fact from Craig Cobb appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the Did you know column on 9 April 2010 (check views). The text of the entry was as follows:
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The following Wikipedia contributor may be personally or professionally connected to the subject of this article. Relevant policies and guidelines may include conflict of interest, autobiography, and neutral point of view. |
NPOV
I am Craig Cobb. I corrected dates, factual errors etc on the page someone created about me. I have read that Wikipedia allows (but discourages) personages from editing their own pages. Wikipedia admin NawlinWiki just deleted every single edit I had made, including a photo of myself which I owned--it is from my own broadcast of Deprogram, and uploaded to Wikipedia Commons--yet admin NawlinWiki pugnaciously reinstated many factual errors into the piece about me. He/She literally deleted my entire entry (which I have saved, of course). This is gratutious railroading against my religious freedom as a Creator by an apparent coterie of editors (above) determined to have it their way, and the facts be darned. It is also likely legally actionable. I respectfully request that my version be examined by a group of less "agenda-izing" editors and reinstated, at least where they deem facts appropo, and that a "this page is in dispute" THEN be put at the top. Unlike Mr./Ms. NawlinWiki, I am Craig Cobb, not hiding behind a handle, and I will gladly show you documentary proof and/or speak with any of you on video Skype to prove my point. I can also can and am completely willing and do offer to show documents substantiating my edits. Thank You for your professional considerations. CraigcobbcreativitypractitionerCraigcobbcreativitypractitioner (talk) 04:31, 2 May 2010 (UTC)
- The above comments regarding NawlinWiki violate WP: NLT. Perhaps they should be deleted. Stonemason89 (talk) 00:11, 3 May 2010 (UTC)]
Biographies of living persons are to be handled according to wikipedia guidelines[1]. Otherwise it can be interpreted as an Attack Page[[2]]. Disagree with the use of the pejorative 'white supremacist' [3]--Wittsun (talk) 08:27, 30 June 2010 (UTC)
I concur with the above writer. Using the word "supremascots" is biased and crude pejorative. WhiteNight14 (talk) 00:55, 9 November 2015 (UTC)
Using Lindstedt & Maynard as References
Lindstedt's wikipage was recently deleted: "Known child molesting, mentally ill Christian Identity politician, who has yet to win even 20% of the vote in any election"[4]. Curt Maynard was involved in a murder-suicide.[5]--Wittsun (talk) 06:44, 30 June 2010 (UTC)
Photos
I found these photos of Craig Cobb: [6]. Would it be possible to use them in the article? Stonemason89 (talk) 14:40, 3 May 2010 (UTC)
Review of Craigcobbcreativitypractitioner Revisions
I have reviewed the revisions by Craigcobbcreativitypractitioner and believe some of these (statements of fact regarding dates, names and places) would be of great aid to the article if we can find reliable published third party source material: from the particulars of his military service to his earlier time in Canada to the longer list of countries to which Mr. Cobb has expressed a desire to emigrate to.
Other revisions, however interesting, regarding Mr. Cobb’s grandfather and the Estonian deportation trial, for example, contain original research and also read more like personal memoir.
Also the statements elaborating upon
I think expansion of the article should focus on providing more detail of the content of Mr. Cobb’s broadcasts, a full list of his disruptions, his participation in Goyfire, and mention of his views regarding the McVeigh case. All assuming sources can be located.
The photograph uploaded by Craigcobbcreativitypractitioner should be included but Mr. Cobb himself will have to authorize its use. Maybe someone can assist with that. The legal forms are a bit beyond my comprehension.
Please note that as the creator of the page I took great care to review all the published sources I could find and to follow Wikipedia guidelines. I avoided calling Mr. Cobb a
Sh.byrn (talk) 22:38, 12 May 2010 (UTC)
- We can say he has been called a neo-Nazi in the article at [7]. The article should perhaps his membership of the white supremacist talk) 10:19, 30 June 2010 (UTC)]
Wittsun Edits of 30 June 2010
I have reverted the edit by Wittsun, a user who has been banned from editing racism-related topics on Wikipedia. The edit removed criticism of Cobb by Lindstedt and Maynard claiming they are not credible sources. However they are being cited not as sources of facts about Cobb but as critics from within the supremicist movement. I have also removed Wittsun's supurious flag about cleanup as there is no argument to support this action on the talk page. Sh.byrn (talk) 06:19, 15 July 2010 (UTC)
- You were probably correct in reverting the edits, although I don't think topic-bans apply retroactively. Stonemason89 (talk) 02:58, 26 August 2010 (UTC)
- I agree with the reverts. talk) 06:48, 26 August 2010 (UTC)]
- I agree with the reverts.
This article should not be speedy deleted because...
This article should not be speedily deleted for lack of asserted importance because it meets
A person is presumed to be notable if he or she has been the subject of multiple published secondary sources which are reliable, intellectually independent of each other, and independent of the subject.
The article currently cites about 30 different reliable published secondary sources, which are intellectually independent of each other. Most of the sources are mainstream news reporting (such as
Sapere aude22 (talk) 14:09, 23 March 2012 (UTC)
RfC
An RfC: Which descriptor, if any, can be added in front of Southern Poverty Law Center when referenced in other articles? has been posted at the Southern Poverty Law Center talk page. Your participation is welcomed. – MrX 16:37, 22 September 2012 (UTC)
Talk show DNA test reliability.
I really think people should read this before trying to pass these DNA tests off as solid facts, yes it should be mentioned in the article that Cobb may be 14% Sub-Saharan African based off a talk show DNA test, but the reliability of those has been question, and I fear that some people with agenda are not respecting wikipedia's guidelines of neutrality.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/science-news/9912822/DNA-ancestry-tests-branded-meaningless.html
173.171.83.140 (talk) 12:46, 12 November 2013 (UTC)
- That telegraph article seems to be dealing with generations way further back. 14% Sub-Saharan African lineage is not a tiny amount. And don't be so bitter, we're all Africans anyway... :) (I'm still laughing at this story, and the guys total lack of intelligent response. Classic). --Somchai Sun (talk) 22:30, 12 November 2013 (UTC)
- I'm trying to be neutral here, so I think you should understand that before accusing me of being "bitter". 173.171.83.140 (talk) 03:46, 13 November 2013 (UTC)
- Don't worry, my comment wasn't really aimed at anyone in particular.--Somchai Sun (talk) 19:49, 13 November 2013 (UTC)
- I'm trying to be neutral here, so I think you should understand that before accusing me of being "bitter". 173.171.83.140 (talk) 03:46, 13 November 2013 (UTC)
This complete absence of neutrality being displayed here. As the IP above noted, the reliability of these ancestry tests is dubious at best. Stating outright that "he is 14% African-American" (incidentally, this is not even what the test claimed, genetic sub-saharan african ancestry is not the same thing as "african-american" ancestry, indicating that the user who added this to the article is a lazy editor) when the test itself is questionable and then making a value judgement with that statement (he is a white supremacist despite being 14% African-American) is grossly inappropriate. I would further argue that something should be added to the paragraph in the Leith, North Dakota section discussing the talk show incident stating to the effect that the validity of such tests is in question even beyond Cobb's own statements in the interest of neutrality. Washablemarker (talk) 06:43, 13 November 2013 (UTC) ]
I'm requesting the removal of false and potentially libelous information on a BLP by deleting the outright false and non-neutral "despite being 14% African-American" from the first line of the article, and I request adding "and the validity of current genetic ancestry tests is in question", citing this, to the 'Cobb dismissed the results as "statistical noise" and "short science".' sentence right before where the period currently is per NPOV. Washablemarker (talk) 16:26, 13 November 2013 (UTC)
DNA tests are a lot more accurate than people give them credit for. My ex-wife used to do DNA testing to identify genetic diseases, and she found out far more about people than they really wanted anyone to know. With some more analysis, scientists could determine which tribes in Sub-Saharan Africa Cobb's ancestors came from, plus what areas of Europe his European ancestors came from, plus what route his paleolithic ancestors took to get from Africa to Europe and where they took refuge from the glaciers during the last ice age. DNA includes a complete set of blueprints for a human being, and it doesn't lie. You can deny a rape, but not when a DNA test confirms it. (58% of "African Americans" are at least 1/8 European in origin) The reason they said "Sub-Saharan Africa" is that the split between the original homo sapiens population in Sub-Saharan Africa and the rest of the world occurred around 50,000 years ago, when the great homo sapiens exodus from Africa began. North Africans and everyone else in the world are a distinct subset different from Sub-Saharan Africans, who have most of the human race's genetic variation. Cobb is white because he carries the definitive European white-skin gene - but that mutation only appeared about 9,000 years ago, although 98% of Northern Europeans carry it today. Prior to that time, Europeans were much darker than they are now. If you want an example of what Europeans were originally like, go to Ireland and find some Black Irish. I know a few of them, and "black" is not a figure of speech. They are descended from the original Irish but haven't inherited the white skin mutation yet. Color is only skin deep and doesn't reliably indicate ancestry. So, to summarize, it's obvious that some of Cobb's ancestors made their way to America on the slave ships, not the Mayflower. If he's 14% African, then at least 2 of his 8 great-grandparents would have been classified as "negro" under the Jim Crow laws many of the Southern states had in the late 1800's and early 1900's, and Cobb himself would be classified as "negro" under some of those laws. This is all very relevant to this article since he is a "white" supremacist. RockyMtnGuy (talk) 17:01, 14 November 2013 (UTC)
DNA Test Results SectionI recommend that the information about the DNA test results be moved out of the "Leith, North Dakota" section, and placed into a section heading of its own within the Biography: "DNA Test Results Suggesting African Heritage". It is not directly related to his activities in Leith, North Dakota. If legitimate sources can be quoted questioning the reliability of the test results, they should be cited. But he did agree to the tests, these results are public and have gone "viral", and given his views they are a significant aspect of his biography. 69.109.120.162 (talk) 22:21, 13 November 2013 (UTC)
I think that the bio needs to be edited to include the genetic testing result
Mr. Cobb submitted a DNA sample to the "Trisha Goddard" talk show and received genetic testing results back during a recent taping that demonstrate that he is 14% Sub-Saharan African. http://www.latimes.com/nation/nationnow/la-na-nn-white-supremacist-dna-20131112,0,7467682.story#axzz2ke4L78Fl http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_svnsF5OLbI 162.232.100.65 (talk) 19:48, 14 November 2013 (UTC)
I b
″Sub-Saharan African″ is a rather general term. The Lemba people of southern Africa have some Jewish ancestry. People in the Horn of Africa surely have very different ancestry to those in West and Central Africa, from where most African-Americans originated.TheTruth-2009 (talk) 06:12, 9 December 2013 (UTC)
PhotoAre there any fair-use photos of Cobb available? He's getting so much attention it'd probably be worth having a photo of him in the article. I'm tempted to say we should use (John Glover as Lionel Luthor, from Smallville), because Cobb looks almost EXACTLY like that guy....although I know we can't do that. FiredanceThroughTheNight (talk) 19:25, 16 November 2013 (UTC) Wanted in CanadaSomething needs to be said about his Canadian arrest and his fugitive status there. It seems he updated his Podblanc site while at a public library in Canada, and since there is racist content being posted on his site, that makes him a hate criminal in the eyes of Canada.72.11.53.145 (talk) 10:09, 11 December 2013 (UTC) More very recent news[9] and [10] - house he owns about to be torn down, girlfriend of Cobb's follower trying to get a court order against a councillor. talk) 11:00, 18 December 2013 (UTC) ]
So this hasn't been edited in a long time. He has since abandoned his plans in Leith and he even got rid of his 6 plots of land. Furthermore the article still refers to an upcoming event last January. 174.68.101.141 (talk) 10:15, 12 May 2014 (UTC)Nos HomophobeEdited the first paragraph that stated that Cobb is homophobic and changed it to anti-LGBT to make it NPOV. Adrift* (talk) 15:10, 4 March 2014 (UTC) Hello. I am Craig Cobb, the subject of this article. I have taken a DNA test with Ancestry.com -- a firm recognized in your own ISOGG Wiki as being one which tests for 500,000 autosomals compared to AncestryBYDNA's mere 176. That AncestryBYDNA test was given to me on the Trisha Goddard show in 2013. That company is also cited in many ISOGG stories and links (your own claims) as having been re-formed because of poor and shady business practices. They then began copying Ancestry.com's (a highly regarded company in ISOGG Wiki) packaging, logo and name. These tests are then offered with bulk discounts to high school sociology teachers with (I believe) the true intent of defaming and shocking young white students. This practice is hateful and harming to these youths psyches, as it was to me in my case. Not too long ago, this page had me in the category of...something like..."Americans of Partial African Descent". That has been retracted. If you see some edits i made (this is permitted under your system) you will see that I was quickly blocked from making these factual changes by a persistent editor with an agenda. In any case, last evening I received the results of my DNA test by Ancestry.com and I have zero "Sub Saharan" African American percentage in my body. You can see screenshots of the test where I have laid them in BELOW this video: http://www.podblanc.guru/craig-cobbs-dna-test-result-from-ancestrycom-500000-alleles_568ad742a.html In my professsion as a white social activist fighting white genocide, i have been imprisoned in 4 countries. Wiki had this "14%" info online early--and it indeed dismayed and stressed me prior to my being arrested and incarcerated for several Class C felonies in Leith. I feel sure that Wiki will agree that I have negated the junk science of the disreputable (look at their histories in ISOGG Wiki) firm AncestryByDNA in testing with a reputable firm. I will be glad to provide you with my emails citing my test index number to confirm these facts. Further, this evening I will put onto You Tube a video made by myself of myself in which I clearly show the tube with the same number, spit into it, and walk it fron the Minot, ND post office parking lot to the parcels bin. In your revision of the piece, I request that you leave in your long-standing calumny but correct it with the new data, and I respectfully ask that you not include any negative terminology such as "Mr Cobb now claims" etc. Thank You very much for your considerations. Sincerely, Craig Cobb, Sherwood, ND [email protected] ' — Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.221.117.89 (talk) 22:15, 10 March 2015 (UTC)
Old DNA test was false. Cobb is 100% European.Here is proof. He took another DNA test by a more credible company. LiberatorLX (talk) 08:31, 13 March 2015 (UTC) Sorry, but the DNA which defines one's Race Doesn't Lie and Cannot ChangeThe source http://www.podblanc.guru/craig-cobb-ancestrycom-genetic-test-700000-alleles-100-european_92d3ea584.html is Cobb's website. It is easy to assume he lied to keep his case alive. --— Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.47.65.239 (talk • contribs) 22:34, 17 December 2015
CitizenshipIt is not stated where Cobb was born. However his early years were in Canada. Since he was deported to Canada it would be safe to say that he must have been a Canadian citizen at the time. The statement that "Canada, where Cobb claims to hold citizenship" is wrong, and reads rather NPOV.Royalcourtier (talk) 09:03, 25 December 2016 (UTC) Jan 2017 pre-inauguration called President Trump "...probably the greatest leader probably in several hundred years."...in honor of President-elect Donald Trump, whom Cobb called "probably the greatest leader probably in several hundred years." [1] References External links modifiedHello fellow Wikipedians, I have just modified 2 external links on Craig Cobb. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs. This message was posted before February 2018. regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template }} (last update: 18 January 2022).
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Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 02:13, 14 August 2017 (UTC) D.o.b?Date of birth, please, in line with Wiki standards. Valetude (talk) 20:58, 28 June 2018 (UTC)
Citations neededI removed three short statements that have been tagged since 2014, 2015 and 2017 respectively. None seem critical to the article, but they could be re-introduced if citations are found. The second is probably the easiest to source and most significant, I read a couple of articles without finding anything.
All the best: Rich Farmbrough 20:26, 9 January 2021 (UTC). |