Talk:Nông Đức Mạnh

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I have removed the statement claiming he is the son of Ho Chi Minh since no credible source for that statement exists. --Nông Dân 21:38, 10 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The current title uses the wrong Đ (it uses eth when D with stroke is desired.) DHN 05:38, 25 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

• Support if it's an obvious typo, just move it, not really necessary to ask first. Gryffindor 13:14, 25 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Can't move, obstructed by redirect already there. DHN 17:27, 25 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Try again. Gryffindor 23:33, 29 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose: should be at Nong Duc Manh, as this is the English language Wikipedia. Jonathunder 22:08, 25 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Done. —

But William Duiker says that if Manh's birth date is correct - September 11, 1940 - his father cannot be Ho, who was in China then and did not return to Vietnam until 1941.[1]

To be Mạnh's dad, Ho would have to be in Vietnam in late December 1939. At this time he was Guiyang, China. He moved to Kunming, China in February 1940. (Ho Chi Minh By William J. Duiker, pp. 237-238). Here are some other sources:

Ho Chi Minh had arrived in the Yunnan capital of Kunming early in the year [1940] "Ho Chi Minh: The Missing Years 1919 - 1941" by Sophie Quinn-Judge, p. 237.

In February 1941, Ho finally returned to Vietnamese side of the Tonkin border, kissing the ground the second that he crossed.[2]

Kauffner (talk) 15:52, 31 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

If you take Manh's official birth date to be gospel, would you even consider the possibility that he's Ho's son when he himself denied it? DHN (talk) 17:09, 31 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The story is out because Mạnh put it out. It is said to have been a factor in his selection as party boss.[3][4] He was asked about it at a press conference in 2001 and responded with a non-denial denial. He gave a clear denial only after he was firmly in power. He has used this date of birth for many years; It's not like the date of birth of a Chinese gymnist. Regardless of whether Mạnh is Ho's son or not, the fact that Duiker doesn't buy the story is still notable.

Mạnh's resume is certainly remarkable. While everyone else was doing military service during the war, he somehow got a cushy gig as a forestry manager. He entered the party as a low-level member in 1980, spent hardly any time in any particular position, but got promoted like clockwork until he received Politburo membership in 1991. He obviously has a powerful sponsor, but there need not be a biological connection. In China, Li Peng zoomed up the party hierarchy in a similar way because he was Zhou Enlai's adopted son and protégé. Kauffner (talk) 10:29, 2 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

You're drifting into

I don't think the date of Ho's return to Vietnam is controversial, so the source shouldn't have to meet academic standards. As for the fake-date-of-birth theory, I remain skeptical myself. For Mạnh to be Ho's son, his official date of birth would have to be two years off and this would imply that he entered college when he was 16. Someone who is gifted academically might enter early, but it seems unlikely that Mạnh would enter early just to shore up a cover story about his dad. If Hoàng Thị Nhị married Nông Văn Lai, as Mạnh told Time, she would have a married name of "Nông Thị Nhị," which is suspiciously similar to the names Trưng is known to have used: Nông Thị Trưng, Nông Thị Bày, and Nông Thị Ngát. It could also be an inside joke since "Trưng" refers to the

Trung sisters and Nhị is the name of one of the sisters. If Nhị is in fact an alias for Trưng, then Lai is presumably her husband, the guy jailed by the French in 1940-45. Of course everything about Mạnh could be made up, like Nguyễn Văn Bé. In that case, there would be no tea leaves to read and he could anybody's son. Kauffner (talk) 09:43, 7 November 2009 (UTC)[reply

]

Married Vietnamese women don't take their husbands' surnames. I'm not sure the case with Tay women but I don't think it's different. Also, Nong is a very popular surname for Tay people (probably more popular than Nguyen for the Vietnamese - I haven't seen any Tay person whose surname is not Nong). DHN (talk) 10:21, 7 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

In Vietnam the rulers can make up everything, for example Mr. Ho Chi Minh‘s year of birth some documents is 1894 (he declared when stayed in the Soviet Unions) but his official is1890 (according to legends a man has year of birth in Luna year of tiger. This man could be the King). So in this case Manh year of birth is fake-date-of-birth.

If he not was a Mr. Ho’son he could not gained highest rank in a short time. He has no talent, he has not go to the war. Why he has promoted so fast?. If he father is Mr. Ho he has made the name of his father be soiled. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 123.24.19.135 (talk) 15:53, 15 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

"In this Vietnamese name, the family name is Nông, but is often simplified to Nong in English-language text. According to Vietnamese custom, this person should properly be referred to by the given name Mạnh." - He's a Tay, and his name should be written in

Although he might be an ethnic Tay, he is a Vietnamese citizen, and as such his name is written in the official language of Vietnam (Vietnamese). DHN (talk) 21:02, 7 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

There is a move discussion in progress on

The whole article says very little about his impact on his positions.
As far as I know, he strengthened the role of the National Assembly from a "rubber stamping" organisation to a body that at occasions stands up to the government and even the Party. --Stefanhanoi (talk) 13:45, 15 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]