Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/France at major beauty pageants

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's

talk page or in a deletion review

). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. I manually removed India, Indonesia, and Philippines for which there is no consensus to delete, I am deleting the rest. I will be happy to recreate individual articles on case-by-case basis, though. Tone 08:48, 20 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

France at major beauty pageants

France at major beauty pageants (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log)

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At the advice of

EDIT: Adding the following 3 articles and their delsorts:

Curaçao at major beauty pageants (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)

Poland at major beauty pageants (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)

Singapore at major beauty pageants (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)

–LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 06:33, 13 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of People-related deletion discussions. –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 06:35, 13 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Singapore-related deletion discussions. –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 06:35, 13 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Poland-related deletion discussions. –LaundryPizza03 (dc̄) 06:35, 13 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete all of them. These are not articles in the sense that a human being wrote them: they could perfectly well be "written" by a computer program, and maybe they were. Athel cb (talk) 06:54, 13 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]
• Neutral comment A good number of these articles were human-written years ago, then had this ghastly grid pasted onto them. It may be best to look at each one individually to see if they worked in a previous form rather then yet another kitchen-sink pageant nom like this. It really feels like we have a hostility to them that's been over-trebled by a minority of editors who could do better to fix things and help editors rather than continuing to micro-manage
  chatter) 08:14, 13 August 2021 (UTC)[reply
  ]

Comment. If by "ghastly grid" you mean the table of years and competitors, it was already there on 1st April 2014 when the France page was created. It may be worth noting the editor who created it is now blocked indefinitely for suspected sockpuppetry. The same editor created a great many other beauty-related articles, such as Miss Honduras. Athel cb (talk) 08:35, 13 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

• You forgot to put the AFD notice on these "87 more articles". Dream Focus 12:34, 13 August 2021 (UTC) fixed[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Jamaica-related deletion discussions. Spiderone^{(Talk to Spider)} 13:16, 13 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete all, not encyclopedic.--Hippeus (talk) 13:34, 13 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete all per
  WP:DINC, but nvm; urgh; some people just have no taste at all as far as aesthetics are concerned... RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 15:19, 13 August 2021 (UTC)[reply
  ]
• Comment The sheer amount of data is striking, should be an external database or private wiki. Unfortunate, someone(s) put a lot of effort into it. Would like to see the pages recoverable should anyone in the future choose to move it elsewhere. -- GreenC 15:36, 13 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

  The user doing this was blocked for sockpuppets. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Sockpuppet_investigations/Mrdhimas/Archive Anyone can use https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Export and https://list.fandom.com/wiki/Special:Import Dream Focus 17:02, 13 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

  Just did it. Everything in the category I did port over fast and easy. https://list.fandom.com/wiki/Special:Log/import list them all. Dream Focus 17:06, 13 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

• delete alll. There is waste of time to handle them individually. If someone wants to undelete any of them individually, citing serious reasons, then let the ball be on their side. Lembit Staan (talk) 19:05, 13 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete - all - as in other Afd. Onel5969 ^{TT me} 23:12, 13 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete All Per the last AfD and everything stated above. ––𝗙𝗼𝗿𝗺𝗮𝗹𝗗𝘂𝗱𝗲 talk 19:45, 14 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete all considering the consensus was already well in favour to remove the first few alphabetic bundles. Ajf773 (talk) 00:44, 15 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete all As per nom in their current state as
  WP:TNT, though If anyone wants to salvage a country or two with proper articles (ex. describe the selection process, or notable events that only concern the country itself), I'd say let them have a go at it. Also noting that Template:Countries at major beauty pageants will need to be TfD as well. Jumpytoo Talk
  03:01, 15 August 2021 (UTC

Dushan is right in that a few of these articles do have some depth to them. I only initially checked the big western countries and I assumed the rest were similar. I skimmed through every article and these 3 have enough that at least they should be sent individually, if not outright kept:

• India at Big Four international beauty pageants
• Indonesia at major beauty pageants
• Philippines at major beauty pageants

There might be a few more that I missed (I only focused on the part above the table), but other than those 3, delete the rest. Jumpytoo Talk 21:19, 16 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete all per
  WP:TNT. As people do watch and follow this kind of talent shows, I would not be against a well-balanced and written country series. The current articles, however, are really bad so we're better off with all gone. gidonb (talk) 16:12, 15 August 2021 (UTC)[reply
  ]
• Delete all. blablabla
  WP:LISTN. JBchrch talk 21:18, 15 August 2021 (UTC)[reply
  ]
• Comment I don't think we would delete the
  Indonesia_at_major_beauty_pageants page if it was not part of a mass deletion. The list could be deleted from this article and it would still stand. I only looked at three pages, has anyone looked at all 87, are we deleting pages without looking at them. Don't mistake me for someone who cares, but first they came for the pageant lists and next they will be after earthquake lists, I didn't want to say nothing. Dushan Jugum (talk) 09:47, 16 August 2021 (UTC)[reply
  ]
• Delete all per
  WP:NOTSTATS. SBKSPP (talk) 00:56, 17 August 2021 (UTC)[reply
  ]
• Delete all per
  WP:INDISCRIMINATE. There is no use of making these kind of article on Wikipedia. Lara (talk) 03:54, 17 August 2021 (UTC)[reply
  ]
• Delete articles with no in-depth coverage, and Keep the few as per Dushan and Jumpytoo (Indonesia, India, Philippines). Not a pageant fan myself but it would be easy to create an article that would pass
  WP:GNG in countries where these pageants are taken seriously (e.g. Philippines).Hariboneagle927 (talk) 10:17, 17 August 2021 (UTC)[reply
  ]
• Comment - I agree with the others that have singled out India, Philippines and Indonesia as ones that should not be deleted as part of this AfD. Spiderone^{(Talk to Spider)} 23:13, 18 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment - upon reviewing all the articles in question, I concur to Keep India, Philippines and Indonesia; these articles contain third party reliable sources and should not be deleted as part of this AfD.---Richie Campbell (talk) 02:17, 19 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep for
  Philippines at major beauty pageants
  or search for reliable sources online, you'll find a plethora of third party reliable sources to support and to improve the article. Below are just some examples and you can search for more through google:
  • https://filipinotimes.net/feature/2018/05/21/want-represent-philippines-international-pageants-heres/
  • https://news.abs-cbn.com/life/01/01/20/rewind-the-decade-ph-became-a-major-major-pageant-powerhouse
  • https://www.rappler.com/nation/special-coverage/map-big4-beauty-pageants
  • https://newsinfo.inquirer.net/1370730/second-most-crowned-country-in-international-beauty-pageants
  • https://technology.inquirer.net/109768/these-5-beauties-are-queens-on-tiktok-too
  • https://philnews.ph/2020/12/12/beauty-pageant-ranking-whats-the-philippines-status-in-the-number-of-crowns/
  • https://asiamedia.lmu.edu/2019/02/11/philippines-powerhouse-of-beauty-pageants/
  • https://philstarlife.com/geeky/379114-philippines-international-beauty-pageant-crowns
  • https://www.scmp.com/video/asia/3013113/asias-pageant-powerhouse-why-philippines-obsessed-beauty-queens
  • https://www.ibtimes.com.au/philippines-brazil-venezuela-three-countries-win-big-four-international-beauty-pageants-1318720
  • https://www.channelnewsasia.com/cnainsider/breaking-silence-ugly-truth-beauty-contests-pageants-philippines-719271
  • https://www.goodnewspilipinas.com/big-4-beauty-pageants-filipina-titlists-on-harpers-bazaar-vietnam-magazine-cover/
  • https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-25550425
  • https://www.pep.ph/lifestyle/parenting/144438/these-bb-pilipinas-daughters-are-worthy-of-their-own-crowns
  • https://mb.com.ph/2021/05/22/the-clash-binibining-pilipinas-versus-miss-world-philippines/
  • https://tribune.net.ph/index.php/2019/06/02/pageantry-crowns-the-philippines/
  • https://www.manilatimes.net/2021/05/21/entertainment-lifestyle/show-times/these-5-beauties-are-queens-on-tiktok-too/1803301

---Richie Campbell (talk) 03:07, 19 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep All and create more similar articles. These articles are basically a list of womens, almost all of whom will qualify for
  WP:BIO if sufficinet research is done using local media. Having a historic record of people who took part in world wide compitition is useful not only for now, but for future generations. Also these articles will be a good starting point for researchers. Having something is better than nothing. Also respect the authours and their contribution who created those articles. nirmal (talk) 04:07, 19 August 2021 (UTC)[reply
  ]

Why do we need to create even more articles that violate

WP:IWORKEDSOHARD are classic examples of arguments to avoid at AfD. It is not Wikipedia's place to be a starting point for researchers, we should only be publishing research that has already been done by established people in the field. Spiderone^{(Talk to Spider)} 08:04, 19 August 2021 (UTC)[reply

]

• Keep for India, Philippines and Indonesia per arguments by Richie Campbell et al. above. I concur with Dushan's funny but legitimate concern that pages are arguably being deleted without being reviewed. Therefore, I abstain about the 84 other articles.Koikefan (talk) 08:28, 19 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep India, Indonesia and Phillipines, don't know about the rest.
  ~Styyx^{Talk? ^-^} 09:43, 19 August 2021 (UTC)[reply
  ]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's

talk page or in a deletion review

). No further edits should be made to this page.